In quest of uniform lunar calculation

[Hussain_KSA]

MAKKAH: An international conference aimed at ending differences on lunar calculations and unite the Muslim Ummah in observing obligatory rituals of fasting and Haj as well as Eid festivals is under way in Makkah.
The three-day conference is organized by the Islamic Fiqh Academy, an affiliate of the Makkah-based Muslim World League (MWL).
A number of prominent figures including religious scholars, jurisprudents and astronomers from the Kingdom and abroad are taking part in the event at the grand conference hall of MWL headquarters.
On behalf of Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques King Abdullah, Minister of Islamic Affairs, Endowments, Call and Guidance Sheikh Saleh Al-Asheikh opened the conference Saturday.
Grand Mufti and President of the Senior Scholars’ Commission Sheikh Abdul Aziz Al-Asheikh, MWL Secretary-General Abdullah Al-Turki, secretary general of the academy Saleh Al-Baqami and consultant at Dubai Islamic Bank Hussein Hamid Hossan were among the dignitaries who addressed the opening session.
In his speech Al-Asheikh highlighted the significance of determining the start of the lunar month on the basis of the sighting of the moon. “Islam had defined that the beginning and ending of the fast depends on the sighting of the crescent and there is no difference of opinion on this. As for Gregorian months, they are mainly for determining four seasons of the year and they have no relevance as far as Shariah rules are concerned,” he said.
The grand mufti reiterated Islamic Shariah principles should be upheld when calculating lunar months. “We are not waging a war with astronomy. But we don’t want to exceed the proper bounds of the Islamic Shariah when making lunar calculations,” he said, while urging the Muslim Ummah to follow relevant Islamic principles.
In his speech, Al-Turki said the conference would come out with proposals and recommendations with regard to achieving some sort of uniformity in determining the timing of the Islamic obligatory rituals of fasting and Haj.
“The Islamic scholars and astronomers would discuss how lunar calculations could be used to unite the Muslim Ummah in determining the fasting month of Ramadan, the timing of Haj and Eid Al-Fitr and Eid Al-Adha,” he said, hoping the event would be a milestone at least in narrowing differences among Islamic scholars and astronomers across the world when making such calculations.
The MWL chief also highlighted the increasing relevance of Islamic astronomy in uniting Muslims worldwide. Spelling out the objectives of convening the conference, Saleh Al-Baqami, secretary general of the academy, hoped the participants would come out with comprehensive solutions to remove the causes of differences with regard to determining the beginning of lunar months.
Continuing deliberations on the second day on Sunday, participants discussed five topics focusing on various aspects regarding lunar months and the role of Islamic Shariah principles in determining them. These included the sighting of the moon to mark the beginning and ending of the months for fasting and Haj.
The participants also discussed the Islamic jurisprudent approach with regard to a number of issues such as settling debts, and Iddat, which is the legally prescribed period of waiting during which a woman may not remarry after being widowed or divorced. The session, which is chaired by Grand Mufti Al-Asheikh, would issue a communiqué after wrapping up its deliberations on Monday.

[profastian]

So now they are gonna vote for a Sharia

[SBM]

Hussain Bhai
Can you please send me the link of the report, Fiqh Council of USA has been following the calculation based Ramadan and Eid and this report will help convince others who have not joined Fiqh Council to re-think about local Moon Sighting,

[Muslim First]

So now they are gonna vote for a Sharia

So you cannot read what was written.
It does not matter to Burhani Taheri DB what they decide. BT DB will always follow fatemi calander.
BTW brother Hussaun this post does not belong in Bohra and reform section. It should be in Islam section.

In his speech Al-Asheikh highlighted the significance of determining the start of the lunar month on the basis of the sighting of the moon. “Islam had defined that the beginning and ending of the fast depends on the sighting of the crescent and there is no difference of opinion on this. As for Gregorian months, they are mainly for determining four seasons of the year and they have no relevance as far as Shariah rules are concerned,” he said.
The grand mufti reiterated Islamic Shariah principles should be upheld when calculating lunar months. “We are not waging a war with astronomy. But we don’t want to exceed the proper bounds of the Islamic Shariah when making lunar calculations,” he said, while urging the Muslim Ummah to follow relevant Islamic principles.

Brother SBM
moonsighting.com has lot of info on this subject.
http://moonsighting.com/

[Hussain_KSA]

Hussain Bhai
Can you please send me the link of the report, Fiqh Council of USA has been following the calculation based Ramadan and Eid and this report will help convince others who have not joined Fiqh Council to re-think about local Moon Sighting,

Brother SBM

Here it is http://arabnews.com/saudiarabia/article574732.ece


Regards.

[Hussain_KSA]

Brother Muslim First

I do agree with your suggesstion.

Dear Admin

Could you kindly move this thread to Islam page.

Regards

[Hussain_KSA]

Makkah meet calls for panel to unify lunar calendar


By ARAB NEWS

Published: Feb 15, 2012 01:51 Updated: Feb 15, 2012 01:51

JEDDAH: A conference of experts in Makkah has called for the formation of a committee of astronomers and Islamic scholars that would try to unify the beginning of lunar months in Muslim countries.


“The committee would consider Makkah as the center for astronomical observation and issue a unified Hijri calendar,” said the final communiqué issued by the three-day conference on Tuesday.

The committee, to be based at the Muslim World League (MWL) in Makkah, will study all the research work so far conducted on the issue.

Organized by the Islamic Fiqh Academy, an affiliate of the MWL, the conference emphasized the importance of sighting the moon to determine the beginning of lunar months of Ramadan and Dul Hijjah.

However, the conference said that Islam has no objection to making use of modern technological means to sight the moon. It pointed out that air pollution as well as an increasing number of aircraft and satellites have made it difficult to sight the moon with the naked eye.

Prominent figures, including Islamic scholars, jurisprudents and astronomers from within and outside the Kingdom, took part in the event at the MWL headquarters. Minister of Islamic Affairs, Endowments, Call and Guidance Saleh Al-Asheikh opened the conference on Saturday.

“The beginning and end of a lunar month will be based on sighting the new crescent, either by the naked eye or using astronomical observatories. If the crescent is not sighted the month will have 30 days,” the communiqué said, quoting the sayings of the Prophet (peace be upon him).

The conferees said the statements of witnesses could not be accepted if it was impossible to sight the moon on the basis of categorical scientific facts. They also agreed that Muslim minorities living in a country should start or stop fasting during Ramadan if the moon was sighted anywhere in the country.

“If a Muslim minority in a non-Muslim country cannot sight the new moon for any reason they should follow the nearest Muslim country or Muslim minority group,” the communiqué said.

The conference urged Muslim astronomers to provide correct information related to moon sightings to relevant authorities in a country. It also urged the public not to cast doubt on moon sightings after approved by the authorities.

Grand Mufti Sheikh Abdul Aziz Al-Asheikh has emphasized the significance of determining the start of the lunar month on the basis of the sighting of the moon. “Islam has defined that the beginning and ending of the fast depends on the sighting of the crescent and there is no difference of opinion on this,” he said.

The grand mufti reiterated Shariah principles should be upheld when calculating lunar months. “We are not waging a war on astronomy. But we don’t want to cross the boundaries of Shariah when making lunar calculations,” he said, while urging the Ummah to stick to relevant Islamic principles.

Brother SBM
Here is the link : http://arabnews.com/saudiarabia/article575812.ece

[Muslim First]

A Suggested Global Islamic Calendar
By Khalid Shaukat
http://moonsighting.com/articles/sugges ... lendar.pdf

[ghulam muhammed]

“The committee would consider Makkah as the center for astronomical observation and issue a unified Hijri calendar,” said the final communiqué issued by the three-day conference on Tuesday.

It would be interesting to see whether bohras go along with the majority of muslims and follow a "unified Hijri calendar" or prefer to follow their existing hijri calendars as a unified calendar could be taboo for them as they would then lose their self glorified status of "hamein mumin chhe" and "ola musalman chhe".

[Muslim First]

by ghulam muhammed
It would be interesting to see whether bohras go along with the majority of muslims and follow a "unified Hijri calendar" or prefer to follow their existing hijri calendars as a unified calendar could be taboo for them as they would then lose their self glorified status of "hamein mumin chhe" and "ola musalman chhe".

I bet dollar to dime that they will not.

[profastian]

“The committee would consider Makkah as the center for astronomical observation and issue a unified Hijri calendar,” said the final communiqué issued by the three-day conference on Tuesday.

It would be interesting to see whether bohras go along with the majority of muslims and follow a "unified Hijri calendar" or prefer to follow their existing hijri calendars as a unified calendar could be taboo for them as they would then lose their self glorified status of "hamein mumin chhe" and "ola musalman chhe".

Who cares what the majority thinks. What really matters is who is right. We think we are right, right now and of course we will never follow such calendar

[ghulam muhammed]

We think we are right, right now

Every believer thinks he/she is right whether he believes in elephant god, monkey god, fire, lucifer or the umpteen number of babas like Asaram, Sri sri ravishankar, Murari Bapu etc. as in present times the barometer of gauging beliefs is money and the materialistic world. The more you acquire of this, the stronger is your belief. Belief requires a thorough scrutiny which is lacking due to the time consumed in various tamashas, sitabis, darees, ziafats, qadambosis and mikats.

we will never follow such calendar

Is this the final farman from kothar ?

[profastian]

We think we are right, right now

Every believer thinks he/she is right whether he believes in elephant god, monkey god, fire, lucifer or the umpteen number of babas like Asaram, Sri sri ravishankar, Murari Bapu etc. as in present times the barometer of gauging beliefs is money and the materialistic world. The more you acquire of this, the stronger is your belief. Belief requires a thorough scrutiny which is lacking due to the time consumed in various tamashas, sitabis, darees, ziafats, qadambosis and mikats.

we will never follow such calendar

Is this the final farman from kothar ?

You have to ask the Kothar for their farmans...

[ghulam muhammed]

profastian wrote:
we will never follow such calendar
Is this the final farman from kothar ?
You have to ask the Kothar for their farmans...

You said that you will not follow that calendar, a statement made by a diehard abde meaning that the verdict is already out. Now what IF kothar approves the same ?

[Muslim First]

From http://moonsighting.com/calendar.html

Suggested Global Islamic Calendar

(If Ulamaa' want to consider)
Click here for detailed information
http://moonsighting.com/global-calendar.html

Since Makkah is our Qibla, and is so dear place to every Muslim, almost every one would accept a Global Islamic Calendar based on Makkah. For that, here is a suggestion. If the moon is born before 3:00 PM Makkah time, then the month begins at sunset of that day everywhere in the world. If the moon is born after 3:00 PM Makkah time, then the month begins on the next day's sunset everywhere. At this cut-off point (3:00 PM Makkah time) the local time at International Dateline (IDL) would be 0:00 (Midnight). So, before a new day begins at IDL, if the moon is already born then the Islamic month begins starting from IDL. Remember, IDL has been universally accepted even by Muslims as the beginning of every day of the week. All Muslims pray Friday prayers on the same day that starts at IDL. Global Islamic Calendar should also follow the same convention of the day, so that the whole world can start Ramadan or Eid on the same day.
The moon born before 3:00 PM Makkah time has Imkaan-e-Ru'yah somewhere on earth, and the moon is born before the day begins at IDL, so the whole world can start the month on the same day. This 3:00 PM Makkah time translates to 12:00 UT. Since moon birth time is usually given in UT, it would be easy to see if the moon was born before 12:00 UT. This suggested Global Islamic Calendar is so easy to calculate for any ordinary Muslim that no calculations are required. All that is needed is New Moon Birth (Conjunction) time which is easily available from many sources on the Internet.

[ghulam muhammed]

Moon Sighting: Hijra Committee prepares a scientific lunar calendar

Kozhikode: Fixing the dates for Ramzan and Eid has remained a topic of confusion and sometimes hot argument among Muslims across the world. Certain leaders of Muslim organisations, Ulema and Qazis own the ‘power’ to decide up on the starting of a lunar month and there were several instances when some among them went wrong and the community didn’t have a unified Ramzan or Eid even within a region.

It would be embarrassing for the Muslim community to be unaware of the Islamic calendar’s prospects and possibilities like the teachings of Quran and Islamic history. The community has become victim to the confusions created by the community’s factional leaders.

Quran asks to observe different phases of moon to set date
He quoted Quran verses [2:189] which tells that it is ‘Ahilla’ [plural denoting different stages of hilal] which one has to observe to finalise the dates of a lunar calendar instead of going in search of a single day’s ‘hilal’, which is almost impossible to find on the night before the first day of a lunar month. He says that in hadees too the Prophet [SAW] used the plural form instead of hilal.

Hijra committee says that if one has to go in search of the Hilal to announce the start of a month they should go for the hilal at the time of “Urj oonil Qadeem” [at around fajr], ie the last visible phase described by Almighty Allah in Quran 36:39.This is the only way we could find a hilal and assess the first day of a month other than the setting one which we find by maghrib [which is already at least 12 hours late since the start of a lunar month].

If we admit to the argument that moon’s rising time must be taken into consideration for different regions specifically, then the Almighty will have to send the new moon twice or thrice in two or three days for each region to announce their Eid and Ramzan and the result will be like when Lailathul Qadr happens at Kochi and a few countries abroad; Kozhikode, Kannur and Kasargod having a different moon rising will be blessed with Lailathul Qadr only the next day night, the arguments of a few Muslim organisational leaders in Kerala are these much illogical!, said Abdul Salam Sullami.

Moon Sighting in Mecca should be accepted by Muslims across the globe
[KNM] Madavoor Mujahid, Secretary CP Muhammed Sullami agreed to the Hijra committee version of lunar calendar and he too emphasised on the fact that if the hilal is announced at Mecca that is enough evidence to announce the start of a month any where in this world. He said that the months so fixed by Almighty Allah will start on the same day of the week and end on the same day of the week, throughout the world.

http://twocircles.net/2012may16/moon_si ... im+News%29

[think]

This will never happen. look at the big differences between the sunni themselves, diobandi and ahmadi and the rest. mulla ishaa in Karachi openly states he will get rid of of all shia mullas. since bohris are shias the bohri mullahs will find hard not to go with the flow ,they could become hypocretes by following the total ummah one time and then secretly doing their own thing later.The same thing happens at haj time anyway. one prays and wears ahram with the ummah at one time and then after all the prayers are over the bohri mullah starts his own prayer .

[profastian]

Moon Sighting: Hijra Committee prepares a scientific lunar calendar

Kozhikode: Fixing the dates for Ramzan and Eid has remained a topic of confusion and sometimes hot argument among Muslims across the world. Certain leaders of Muslim organisations, Ulema and Qazis own the ‘power’ to decide up on the starting of a lunar month and there were several instances when some among them went wrong and the community didn’t have a unified Ramzan or Eid even within a region.

It would be embarrassing for the Muslim community to be unaware of the Islamic calendar’s prospects and possibilities like the teachings of Quran and Islamic history. The community has become victim to the confusions created by the community’s factional leaders.

Quran asks to observe different phases of moon to set date
He quoted Quran verses [2:189] which tells that it is ‘Ahilla’ [plural denoting different stages of hilal] which one has to observe to finalise the dates of a lunar calendar instead of going in search of a single day’s ‘hilal’, which is almost impossible to find on the night before the first day of a lunar month. He says that in hadees too the Prophet [SAW] used the plural form instead of hilal.

Hijra committee says that if one has to go in search of the Hilal to announce the start of a month they should go for the hilal at the time of “Urj oonil Qadeem” [at around fajr], ie the last visible phase described by Almighty Allah in Quran 36:39.This is the only way we could find a hilal and assess the first day of a month other than the setting one which we find by maghrib [which is already at least 12 hours late since the start of a lunar month].

If we admit to the argument that moon’s rising time must be taken into consideration for different regions specifically, then the Almighty will have to send the new moon twice or thrice in two or three days for each region to announce their Eid and Ramzan and the result will be like when Lailathul Qadr happens at Kochi and a few countries abroad; Kozhikode, Kannur and Kasargod having a different moon rising will be blessed with Lailathul Qadr only the next day night, the arguments of a few Muslim organisational leaders in Kerala are these much illogical!, said Abdul Salam Sullami.

Moon Sighting in Mecca should be accepted by Muslims across the globe
[KNM] Madavoor Mujahid, Secretary CP Muhammed Sullami agreed to the Hijra committee version of lunar calendar and he too emphasised on the fact that if the hilal is announced at Mecca that is enough evidence to announce the start of a month any where in this world. He said that the months so fixed by Almighty Allah will start on the same day of the week and end on the same day of the week, throughout the world.
What an idiot? What if the sun for the next day has already arisen somewhere else before the moon is sighted in Mecca? Wahabi Mullas are really idiots

http://twocircles.net/2012may16/moon_si ... im+News%29

[anajmi]

What an idiot? What if the sun for the next day has already arisen somewhere else before the moon is sighted in Mecca? Wahabi Mullas are really idiots

Not really. There is a hadith from the prophet (saw) that he broke his fast when travellers came to him with news that they had sighted the moon during their travel. So even if the sun has arisen and Mecca declares eid, it would be ok to break the fast and celebrate eid on that day, that is, if it has been agreed that Mecca is going to be the center for declaring beginning and end of months.

[ghulam muhammed]

Controversies over Sighting the Moon: What is the Way out?

Every year, as the beginning of Ramadan approaches, Muslims the world over start yearning to see the new moon of Ramadan in order to observe the first fast of the blessed month. But on the other hand, serious debates and controversies also emerge around the Muslim world. Every year, theological controversies appear in many Muslim countries regarding the sighting of the new moon of Ramadan. It happens mainly because of different sightings and different schools of thought among Muslims. But who are the worst hit by this jurisprudential clash of ulema? Obviously, you, we and a common Muslim like me.

The blessed month of Ramadan requires us to exhibit the true spirit of unity and integrity. But ironically, we start the very glorious month with huge differences over the moon-sighting which sometimes lead to unnecessary divisions among ourselves. With only a couple of days left for the moon of Ramadan, it is high time we reflect on proper ways to get out of this dilemma. We should not forget that unity is the spirit of Ramadan al Mubarak, and this can only be achieved by unanimous efforts and collective decisions made by the representatives of Ummah in each region and not by individuals acting arbitrarily on their own.

More importantly, we should strive to achieve our unity on all occasions and in all aspects, not only in the beginning and end of Ramadan and celebrating the Eids. It is totally against the spirit of Islam for Muslims in the same country to be divided in their rituals and their Islamic dates and events. The Islamic spirit is against division and disunity. That is why Muslims are not allowed to hold two congregational Prayers in one mosque at the same time.

Delving deeper into this regard, Dr. Sano Koutoub Moustapha, professor of Fiqh and its principles, International Islamic University, Malaysia, states the following:

“Indeed, it is disheartening to know that the Muslim countries and communities around the globe will surely be fasting on different days. Thus, each country or community has its own way to determine the beginning and end of Ramadan.

However, I believe there is no compulsion or obligation that Muslims must fast on the same day if they are living in different countries.

“In other words, it shouldn’t be considered as a disunity when Muslim countries and communities fast on different days, as this was happening in the first century of Hijrah and the hadith of Kuraib is well known about it: Kuraib reported that Umm Fadl, daughter of Harith, sent him (her son Fadl) to Mu`awiyah in Syria. I (Fadl) arrived in Syria and did the needful for her. It was there in Syria that the month of Ramadan commenced. I saw the new moon (of Ramadan) on Friday. I then came back to Madina at the end of the month. `Abdullah ibn `Abbas (may Allah be pleased with him) asked me (about the new moon of Ramadan) and said, ‘‘When did you see it?’’ I said, ‘‘We saw it on the night of Friday.’’ He said, ‘‘(Did) you see it yourself?’’ I said, ‘‘Yes, and the people also saw it and they observed fast and Mu`awiyah also observed fast.’’ Whereupon he said, ‘‘But we saw it on Saturday night. So we would continue to observe fast till we complete thirty (fasts) or we see it (the new moon of Shawwal).’’ I said, ‘‘Is the sighting of the moon by Mu`awiyah not valid for you?’’ He said, ‘‘No, this is how the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) has commanded us’’ (Muslim).”

However, it is forbidden and prohibited for Muslims living in the same country or community to fast or end their fast on different days. For example, the Muslims in India must fast on the same day, they must refer to the unanimous consensus of Indian Muslims, not the leadership of Muslims in any other country. They don’t need to refer to Muslims in Europe, America, Africa, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, or anywhere else. Thus, Muslims should follow the directives and instructions adopted by the Islamic jurists or Darul Qada (دارالقضاء) in their community. All in all, it is forbidden to bypass the general consensus of Muslims in the country or community. Unity is the only objective behind such Islamic concepts.

[SBM]

Moon-sighting-confusion-delays-Ramzan-in-Mumbai
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 084464.cms

[ghulam muhammed]

Moon sighting buffoonery

The silence of the Ummah ( community ) against the frequent goof ups about sighting the moon , to announce the commencement of Ramazan or the goof up while sighting the moon to announce the end of the fasting period ( or Eid ) by the Royat-e-Hilal committee ( moon sighting committee) appears more like the entertainment committee to non Muslims .

There has been confusion for the third time in five years as mentioned in a leading news paper , yet , these chosen ones of God do not deem it proper to update the system of sighting the moon .

The Western world which is frequently condemned by these chosen ones of God for their liberal ways of society , have now scientifically tried to explain the God particle by scientific methods . The numerous advancements in Medicine and Engineering can be attributed to the development of science and technology .

As people say it was humerous , nay , deplorable when the secretary of the Royat-e-Hilal committee made a statement that even using a telescope is not permitted, it has to be spotted with the naked eye , and that " science finds no place in matters of religion ," more so in declaration of festivals .The moot point " is this religious buffoonery or religious knowledge ?

These very chosen ones of God, or buffoons of paradise , ever realize that the spectacles they wear to compensate poor eyesight should be discarded because this is also a scientific innovation . These men of God or buffoons of paradise do not acknowledge information given over telephone , because , the telephone is again a scientific and electronic equipment .

Yet , these very sages in long robes have ruined many marriages by performing Nikah over the telephone . They do not appear to be ashamed to admit that their committee comprising of seventeen members , out of which , only four of them are educated .It implies that the rest of the pseudo Ulema are either illiterate or ignorant .

Another person said to be a Khateeb , claiming to be educated and an entrepreneur also makes a similar gaffe by stating , that people in Mangalore go to the high seas to sight the moon if it was not visible from the city on cloudy days .

It is also common knowledge that this very person had brought Satelite tracking system with him for giving lectures upon Islam , which was brought with him while returning from an Islamic conference in the Middle east .

It pains to hear how the Ulema and Khateeb who profess to have an ocean of knowledge be so ignorant in matters of sighting the moon . it goes to establish the gullibility of the Muslim community to pander to such idiotic persons as their religious heads or teachers .

It is becoming a common feature to have such uneducated , illiterate and stupid buffoonery pass of as religious ethics and religious reverence towards such pseudo Ulema who time and again taken people for a joy ride in the name of religion .

It is high time the intellectual and educated Muslims raise their voice against such buffoonery .

Ghiasuddin Akbar .

ghiasuddin akbar <ghias_aj@yahoo.com