'Islamic State' calls for a Shiite-free Arabian Peninsula

[fayyaaz]

According to the US-based SITE monitoring group, an IS-affiliated group in Saudi Arabia has defended attacks on Shiite Muslims in a 13-minute long audio message, which it posted online late Friday.

The so-called Najd Province group said in the message that Shiites should be "killed everywhere."

The IS "has ordered its soldiers everywhere to kill the enemies of religion, especially the Rafidha (Shiites)," a group spokesman is heard saying in the audio.

"They are disbelievers and apostates, and their blood is permissible to be shed, and their money is permissible to be taken. It is a duty upon us to kill them … and even to purify the land from their faith," the message continued.

http://www.dw.de/islamic-state-calls-fo ... a-18487743

[KA786110]

No surprise there. These type of edicts and actions are clear proofs that these people have no relation whatsoever with the faith of Islam. These are the groups about whom the Holy Prophet(pbuh) warned us in several of his sayings of end-of-days.

These groups are the spreaders and purveyors of darkness. They would not want any light of Imaan left in Middle East. Eliminating Shias and other Sunnis who do not follow their creed would do that. So Sunnis who do not agree with ISIS interpretations are next to be eliminated as well. But God(swt) is the protector of His true belivers.

[araz5253]

Look who is rumour mongering about Islam: A self proclaimed athiest , then an Ismaili partisan pops out and comments and they think they have true "Imaan" and others dont have it. You people are either fooling your own selves or are fooling us.

[KA786110]

Another comment from you which shows your ignorance of cold hard facts. Are you that naive to believe that ISIS(whahbis, salafis etc.) is doing any thing good?

[JavedhJuma]

Look who is rumour mongering about Islam: A self proclaimed athiest , then an Ismaili partisan pops out and comments and they think they have true "Imaan" and others dont have it. You people are either fooling your own selves or are fooling us.

Look who popped up, the self declared cultist. Did you even read the article? Ismaili never claimed he has the truer Imaan and others don't have it. Why do you have to put a twist to everything. Why do the atheist and the Ismaili have to fool you. You have already proven here that there is no bigger fool than you here.

[KA786110]

Javed, thanks for pointing the obvious to this fanatic.

Hey araz5253,
Please re-read my post again. I quote the relevant portion below:

These groups are the spreaders and purveyors of darkness. They would not want any light of Imaan left in Middle East. Eliminating Shias and other Sunnis who do not follow their creed would do that. So Sunnis who do not agree with ISIS interpretations are next to be eliminated as well. But God(swt) is the protector of His true believers.

You and your ilk are quite adept at taking things out of context and totally twisting/manipulating facts. You tried to do the same thing to my post as you do to Holy Quran. You guys live in parentheses because all your Quranic quotations need those to make the ayats suitable for your purpose. Your purpose is nothing more than to mislead Muslims who do not belong to your cult.

[salim]

Dear KA786110 and JavedhJuma,

I think you missed a good catch that anajmi made about araz5253. araz5253 is not what he is acting like. He wants all of us to believe that he is some ISIS super extremist belonging to Sunni interpretation. In real he is a regular Bohra (check out his other id Topiwala).

araz5253 (topiwalla's extrimist version) is trying to isolate people with his very extreme views. The goal of araz5253 here is to make non-sunnis believe that Sunnis are extremists and also spread rumors about other liberal faiths. Somehow he thinks he will win by making a divide among Muslims and make them fight with each other.

One of my Indian friend made me aware of very similar tactics that BJP used to make Muslims fight in India and help Modi win election.

I am not sure about the motive of Topiwala here. Most of the bohras are peace loving. Topiwala, you call your Dai, Ambassador of Peace and now what you are spreading is very opposite. Some time back you were inviting some people on this form back to Bohra fold. I feel that there is nothing wrong in inviting people to an interpretation which you feel is good, but your way is wrong. Are you thinking that by making extremist ids and spreading lies you will be able to creating a divide and bring back all progressive to your fold.

If Topiwala goal is to bring the people to the extremes, he is probably also using a Shia sounding ID on this form. He may be asking a question with one of his (shia sounding) id and answering it with another (suni sounding) id. Quran and Muhammad never supported any extremism.

[JavedhJuma]

Brothers KA786110 and Salim,

I know my wahabi friend has kicked 5253 many times and at the time I thought he was wrong. But he was right. Still his eyes did not open.

He is not only a disgrace to Islam, but to his present religion which he portrays to be wahabi, sunni etc. I don't know of wahabis or salafis, only what I read in papers so I am not going to judge them, but the sunnis that I know and meet have very different take on Islam.

I had rather be in the company of Jews and Christians than this cultist Araz5253.

Having said this please read the following which I received today. I don't know if you guys have seen this before. Araz please, shut your eyes:

Robert Remington is a Victoria, B.C.-based writer and author. Imagine, a Muslim sect that advocates religious tolerance, supports gender equality, educates women, restores ancient monuments, preserves traditional music, engages in institution building and creates wealth to help bring disadvantaged people out of poverty.

It’s no wonder that the Ismailis drive Islamic State crazy.

The killing of 43 and wounding of 30 Ismailis in Karachi by the IS loyalist group Jundullah must not be diminished as another case of sectarian violence perpetrated on a Pakistani religious minority, as described in many media reports. It is an attack on a group that symbolizes all that is a good in a civilized world, a group that represents everything that IS and its ilk seek to destroy.

A tolerant community with an enlightened view of Islam, the Ismaili community through the many tentacles of the Aga Khan Development Network is engaged in life-changing development work in 30 countries. Its non-denominational network of 325 schools, two universities, 11 hospitals and 195 health clinics is supported by tithes from the Ismaili community, grants from donor nations and profits generated by a worldwide business empire of some 90 companies that in 2013 generated revenues of $3.5-billion (U.S.).Driven by the ethics of pluralism, diversity and respect as espoused by its spiritual leader, the British-born, Harvard-educated billionaire Prince Karim Aga Khan IV, the Ismaili community indirectly supports an army of 80,000 employees, more than 90 per cent of whom are non-Ismaili, who bring health, education and economic hope to people in some of the poorest regions of the world.For noble work such as this, the Ismailis are considered kafir (heretics) by gangs of medieval brutes like Jundullah, which on Wednesday decided to put bullets in the heads of innocent Ismailis in a bus on their way to a prayer service in Karachi.



“Thanks be to Allah, 43 apostates were killed and around 30 were wounded in an attack carried out by ‘Islamic State’ soldiers on a bus transporting Shiite Ismaili infidels in the city of Karachi,” read a Jundullah statement on an IS-linked Twitter account.

The attack has been aptly called an unprecedented horror inflicted on the Ismaili community, who were described after the attack by Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif as “a very patriotic and peaceful people who have always worked for the well-being of Pakistan.” There has, however, also been sporadic violence against Ismailis in the mountainous northern areas of Chitral and Gilgit-Baltistan. Last year, the Pakistani Taliban, with whom Jundullah is affiliated, vowed to wage an armed struggle against Ismailis in the northern regions, which I visited in late 2005. There, I met daughters of illiterate farmers who were educated in the Aga Khan system and applying to Western universities in hopes of becoming doctors, teachers and pilots.This is heresy, according to a 50-minute Taliban video posted in February, 2014, in which a narrator declares, “The Aga Khan Foundation is running 16 schools and 16 colleges and hostels where young men and women are given free education and brainwashed to keep them away from Islam,” adding that the foundation’s schools and hospitals are espionage tools in the hands of foreign powers.

In the past decade, I have visited Aga Khan projects in East Africa, India, Central Asia and Pakistan. I’ve walked the slums of Karachi, Nairobi and Delhi with dedicated Aga Khan workers and volunteers, seeing them bring hope to areas where the Taliban would bring none. How dare these Ismailis. Many, even in Pakistan, dress in Western clothing. When I was there during Ramadan in 2005, they even served me wine, a gracious display of hospitality to a Westerner during their most observant month of self-discipline.

Guys get ready for bricbats. Just ignore them.

Today, I weep for the innocent victims on that bus in Karachi. To those who buy into the despicable narrative that paints all practitioners of Islam with the same brush, I can only despair.

[SBM]

Br Javedjuma, Salim and other Agha Khani friends of Dawoodi-Bohras.com
I have great admiration for Agha Khan, for his forward thinking and him going out in public and defending Islam and Muslims and asking world to differentiate between the good and evil which exists in every religion, I admire his philanthropy and his work to save and restore Islamic historical sites while Saudis are bent on destroying all those
BUT
having said all that , here is the problem, he has not instilled Islamic values in his followers, still your community does not follow 5 or 7 Pillars of Islam. If your community would adhere to those basic faith of 5-7 pillars of Islam then your community will be a real role model for the entire world. Having an honest and learned person as a leader (you call him Imam, we do not) who does not ask his followers to make ROTI and asks his follower just learn HOME SCIENCE and does not get carried on HUMAN PALKHI,
Just like Nation of Islam founder Wallace Mohammed who brought a great discipline to his follower, Agha Khan has done the same, unfortunately both communities did not follow the basic pillars of Islam.
Hopefully just like son of Wallace Fard Mohammed who finally broke away from his father and brought a great majority of his followers to main stream Islam and still keep their identity, Agha Khan may succeed in doing the same.

[KA786110]

Br SBM,
You are entitled to your opinion. But just remember "walayat/Imamat' is their to guide followers according to needs of the time.
When you say Islamic values you are mostly referring to rituals like forms of namaz and other items. But as far as offering prayers etc. Ismailis do those to and they are compulsory not optional either. Each interpretation has differences but core Islamic values like belief in one God, Last Prophet(pbuh), prayers, zakat, being truthful, generous, tolerant etc remain common in each school.

Regards

[SBM]

I have in no way demeaned Agha Khanis what I am saying that still a great majority of Agha Khani community does not consider praying 5 times a day-Fasting during month of Ramadan and going for Hajj as the requirements to be Muslim
May be it is happening but it seems very very slow in coming.

[Muslim First]

I have in no way demeaned Agha Khanis what I am saying that still a great majority of Agha Khani community does not consider praying 5 times a day-Fasting during month of Ramadan and going for Hajj as the requirements to be Muslim
May be it is happening but it seems very very slow in coming.

Tell this guy that there is no such school which has no Namaaz, no fast and hajj, no Jumma, no Wadu and belief that Quran is altered and has 10 more chapters and they are with their MHI.

He is just here to make his point that all you need to be Muslim is Shahada.

[salim]

I have in no way demeaned Agha Khanis what I am saying that still a great majority of Agha Khani community does not consider praying 5 times a day-Fasting during month of Ramadan and going for Hajj as the requirements to be Muslim
May be it is happening but it seems very very slow in coming.

While there is huge room for improvement, according to recent survey of ismailis between the age 20-60 years do fast at least a few days in Ramadan.

Ismailis do go to Hajj. Family responsibilities are deemed more important, but whoever can effort they do go.

There are issues that ismailis are fighting among themselves. Sometimes it takes time to change elders, but new generation is changing fast.

[salim]

Belief that Quran is altered and has 10 more chapters and they are with their MHI.

This is 0.00001% of ismailis. I don't think we can ever be able to fix them. Aga Khan is very clear on this, that Quran was not altered. Numerous times Aga Khan said that Quran is word of God. And when in Quran God says it can't be altered then it can't be altered period.

No ismaili or shia or any other Muslim should believe otherwise.


The people who preach what you said, you can count them on fingers. I had talked to them, they don't want to believe me. How can we help someone who don't want to help themselves. May Allah show them light. Now I feel that it is just waste of time to even give them any importance.

The only problem with Ismailis are we usually don't through people out of the fold. And they are taking advantage of it. I am not saying they are never successful. They do sometimes get converts. For a while the convert pays their bills but sooner or latter these converts do realize that these are not telling the truth.

While I don't like these people, but I am proud of the system where if you have a different opinion you are not kicked out of the community or no one forces you to believe what you don't want to believe. A few people will always exploit the system.

Even sunnis have dhongi babas, who call themselves sunnis, They give you taviz and take your money. Every community has this.

[KA786110]

I have in no way demeaned Agha Khanis what I am saying that still a great majority of Agha Khani community does not consider praying 5 times a day-Fasting during month of Ramadan and going for Hajj as the requirements to be Muslim
May be it is happening but it seems very very slow in coming.

Brother SBM,
I did not take any affront from your comment at all. All I said that it is your opinion and you have that right and so do we.

MF,
Muslim = Anyone who accepts Islam by reciting Shahadah
Ahle-Imaan = One who accepts Islam and obeys Allah's commands.

An Ahle-Imaan is definitely a Muslim but not necessarily other way around. Example of mere Muslims in name only would be the people who are calling for Shiite-Free Middle East. That is my understanding and even Qur'an differentiates Muslims that way. You do not have to agree with it.

Other items: Salat, Roza, Wadu, hajj etc have been discussed in this forum multiple times in details.

[zinger]

This post is for the Ismaili bashers/finger-pointers:

I have just this one thing to say. Clean up the mess in your/our house first before pointing fingers. Remember what Jesus Christ said about casting the first stone???

i have nothing but contempt about the many sanctimonious "true Muslims" here, who "claim" to be following "their version of true Islam" but forget the very basics of humanity.

To all of you, i say "get a life". Sort out the issues in your/our community before pointing out the wrongs in the Ismaili faith

[Muslim First]

This post is for the Ismaili bashers/finger-pointers:

I have just this one thing to say. Clean up the mess in your/our house first before pointing fingers. Remember what Jesus Christ said about casting the first stone???

i have nothing but contempt about the many sanctimonious "true Muslims" here, who "claim" to be following "their version of true Islam" but forget the very basics of humanity.

To all of you, i say "get a life". Sort out the issues in your/our community before pointing out the wrongs in the Ismaili faith

Br Zinger
ASAK

Just look at this thread. Out of 16 posts one is by Araz, one by me, 2 by SBM one by you and rest by 3 Ismaili enforcers. There is no Ismaili Bashi here. When they KA or Javed insists that you are Muslim just by Shahada and rest can be different as per their Imam's interpretation, SBM and myself just made point that Muslim is one who believes in 5 founding principal of Islam as per Quran and Prophetic Hadith.

Take a look at this thread
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10731

Poster wants to brag that judge is Ismaili and other enforcer is needling so called Agakhani bashers to show up.
He is not first Muslim judge in USA. There are more in other states.

My posts are monitored and I am not interested to bash them except just remind them that Islam is not just Shahada.
If you want to be a duck then you should walk like a duck and quake like a duck.
Despite differences in style Shia, Sunni and Bohra do look like ducks, may be different size and colors.

As far as straightening out our own mess, it is out of hands of ordinary Shia or Sunni Muslims. Western world is equally involved in it. We are here just posting stories and having so called useless debates, which always ends up in name calling.

You should take control of this web site and make it strictly Mustali (Bohra) Ismaili Muslim site.

Good luck
Wasalaam

[anajmi]

Who created the Islamic State

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/D ... lame-game.

Looks like the only ones not a part of the creation of the Islamic State are muslims themselves!!

[araz5253]

anajmi , is this from christian science ? Yes ISIS was an unintended creation of Bush and American policies but it is what it is just an inintended consequence, Bush never imagined rise of IS nor anyone else, it just happened and if you are staying in America you have also contributed towards it by supporting the invasion which you had brazenly declared on this forum , I hope you already read this:
http://www.theatlantic.com/features/arc ... ts/384980/

and read this too:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair- ... 17157.html

[anajmi]

If i supported the invasion, then you are an abde idiot called topiwala. Oh but wait, you are!!

[anajmi]

"Those who would not conform to this view should be killed, their wives and daughters violated, and their possessions confiscated, he wrote. "

This quote attributed to abdul wahhab is unverifiable. Similarly to people on this board who refer to anyone they do not agree with as a wahhabi, all evil crap has been attributed to abdul wahhab just to demonize islam and muslims and conniving wolves like araz5253 with their duplicity help propagate this view.

[zinger]

This post is for the Ismaili bashers/finger-pointers:

I have just this one thing to say. Clean up the mess in your/our house first before pointing fingers. Remember what Jesus Christ said about casting the first stone???

i have nothing but contempt about the many sanctimonious "true Muslims" here, who "claim" to be following "their version of true Islam" but forget the very basics of humanity.

To all of you, i say "get a life". Sort out the issues in your/our community before pointing out the wrongs in the Ismaili faith

Br Zinger
ASAK

Just look at this thread. Out of 16 posts one is by Araz, one by me, 2 by SBM one by you and rest by 3 Ismaili enforcers. There is no Ismaili Bashi here. When they KA or Javed insists that you are Muslim just by Shahada and rest can be different as per their Imam's interpretation, SBM and myself just made point that Muslim is one who believes in 5 founding principal of Islam as per Quran and Prophetic Hadith.

Take a look at this thread
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10731

Poster wants to brag that judge is Ismaili and other enforcer is needling so called Agakhani bashers to show up.
He is not first Muslim judge in USA. There are more in other states.

My posts are monitored and I am not interested to bash them except just remind them that Islam is not just Shahada.
If you want to be a duck then you should walk like a duck and quake like a duck.
Despite differences in style Shia, Sunni and Bohra do look like ducks, may be different size and colors.

As far as straightening out our own mess, it is out of hands of ordinary Shia or Sunni Muslims. Western world is equally involved in it. We are here just posting stories and having so called useless debates, which always ends up in name calling.

You should take control of this web site and make it strictly Mustali (Bohra) Ismaili Muslim site.

Good luck
Wasalaam

MF bhai, you are looking at this one post only here. you are looking at the trees but not the forest here. i can pull up numerous posts that are made explicitly with the intention of ismaili bashing

i really am not interested in whether non-Ismalis consider Ismailis as Muslims or not.
Allah is still there. He has not died and put someone else in charge.
He will still be the final deciding authority on who is a Muslim and who is not. not you or some other tom dick or harry and certainly not me.

As for straightening the mess, you are wrong. it is entirely in our hands. if it wasnt, then the reform movement has no reason to exist. change begins with you, like it did for me. you will have to clean your own house, your neighbour or local politician or the western world will not!

[fayyaaz]

....and conniving wolves like araz5253 with their duplicity.....

To think that all this time I assumed you were his Dad! Experiencing a little teen rebellion from an offspring, eh?

[qutub_mamajiwala]

Who created the Islamic State

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/D ... lame-game.

Looks like the only ones not a part of the creation of the Islamic State are muslims themselves!!

sure,-- what else can be done for brain dead people.
u see donkeys dont have choices regarding their masters or how they treat them.
they are made to slough.
at least donkeys have benefit of doubt, coz they do not have brains, but what can be done with people who have brains, but do not use it coz their stupid ideology prevents them to do it

[araz5253]

"Those who would not conform to this view should be killed, their wives and daughters violated, and their possessions confiscated, he wrote. "

This quote attributed to abdul wahhab is unverifiable. Similarly to people on this board who refer to anyone they do not agree with as a wahhabi, all evil crap has been attributed to abdul wahhab just to demonize islam and muslims and conniving wolves like araz5253 with their duplicity help propagate this view.

So can you please shed some light on this answer:

http://politics.stackexchange.com/a/7961/1686

Intra Muslim Politics and ISIS

This is not the first time that a caliphate has been declared and there is opposition from Muslims themselves who did not wish to compromise their freedom for caliphate, such people were decried as apostate who fought them and did not pay Zakat by none other then the most respected and the first caliph of Islam interestingly with the same name:Abu Bakr:

The Ridda wars (Arabic: حروب الردة), also known as the Wars of Apostasy, were a series of military campaigns launched by the Caliph Abu Bakr against rebel Arabian tribes during 632 and 633 AD, just after Muhammad died. The rebels' position was that they had submitted to Muhammad as the prophet of God, but owed nothing to Abu Bakr.

These people were considered to be rebels and apostates by the first caliph and he actively fought them and even enslaved them which is actually more worse then what ISIS does as ISIS does not enslave women who are sunnis even if they don't pledge allegiance to their caliph. Also a widespread apostasy was reported:

In the fourth week of August 632, Abu Bakr moved to Zhu Qissa with all available fighting forces. There he planned the strategy of the Campaign of the Apostasy to deal with the various enemies who occupied the entire land of Arabia except for the small area in the possession of the Muslims. 5 The battles which he had fought recently against the apostate concentrations at Zhu Qissa and Abraq were in the nature of immediate preventive action to protect Medina and discourage further offensives by the enemy. These actions enabled Abu Bakr to secure a base from which he could fight the major campaign that lay ahead, thus gaining time for the preparation and launching of his main forces. Abu Bakr had to fight not one but several enemies: Tulayha at Buzakha, Malik bin Nuwaira at Butah, Musaylima at Yamamah. He had to deal with widespread apostasy on the eastern and southern coasts of Arabia: in Bahrain, in Oman, in Mahra, in Hadhramaut and in Yemen. There was apostasy in the region south and east of Mecca and by the Quza'a in northern Arabia.

The word apostasy is used even for cases where people believed in Muhammad but refused to recognize the first caliph Abu Bakr. Hence we know exactly from where ISIS is drawing its political inspiration from.

[anajmi]

To think that all this time I assumed you were his Dad!

Well, I am glad you were wrong once more.

[anajmi]

The Ridda wars (Arabic: حروب الردة), also known as the Wars of Apostasy, were a series of military campaigns launched by the Caliph Abu Bakr against rebel Arabian tribes during 632 and 633 AD, just after Muhammad died. The rebels' position was that they had submitted to Muhammad as the prophet of God, but owed nothing to Abu Bakr.

Actually, this practice is also followed by the bohras of today. If some abde suddenly develops a pair of cojones and declares that he has submitted to the Imam but owes nothing to the Dai, the Dai will declare war on this abde with baraat!!

[ghulam muhammed]

Special Report: Egypt deploys scholars to teach moderate Islam, but skepticism abounds

In his battle against militant Islam, Egyptian President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi is relying not just on bomber planes and soldiers but on white-turbaned clerics from Al-Azhar, Egypt's 1,000-year-old center for Islamic learning. He wants clerics to counter radicalism in the classroom.

In a televised speech in January at an Al-Azhar conference center in Cairo, Sisi called for "a religious revolution" in Islam. Radicalized thinking, he told the audience of Islamic scholars, had become "a source of anxiety, danger, killing and destruction for the rest of the world."

That had to change – and the scholars had a leading role to play, in schools, mosques and on the airwaves.

"You, imams, are responsible before Allah. The entire world is waiting. The entire world is waiting for your next word because this nation is being torn apart."

Surprised by the president's bluntness, the scholars went "white as sheets," some of those in the audience told a Western official.

The president's warning is part of a much larger project. To contain the radical Islamist movement roiling his nation, Sisi has most conspicuously been using the law and brute force. But he is also promoting a more moderate and less politicized version of the faith.

FULL ARTICLE :

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/05/ ... 7T20150531

[araz5253]

The Ridda wars (Arabic: حروب الردة), also known as the Wars of Apostasy, were a series of military campaigns launched by the Caliph Abu Bakr against rebel Arabian tribes during 632 and 633 AD, just after Muhammad died. The rebels' position was that they had submitted to Muhammad as the prophet of God, but owed nothing to Abu Bakr.

Actually, this practice is also followed by the bohras of today. If some abde suddenly develops a pair of cojones and declares that he has submitted to the Imam but owes nothing to the Dai, the Dai will declare war on this abde with baraat!!

What bohras do or dont is irrelevant , the practice of barat is a well grounded practice practiced even by prophet pbuh himself , I am sure you know about it. Also are you trying to say what Abu Bakr did was wrong in fighting the rebels? Also do you know Muhammad bin hanafia was the result of a women slave taken during riddah wars, A women slave who claimed to be Muslim but did not pay allegiance to the first caliph.

[anajmi]

What Hazrat Abu Bakr did was right. What the ISIS Abu Bakr is doing is wrong. When the prophet (saw) did baraat he was right. When the Dai does baraat he is wrong. Actually, the ISIS Abu Bakr is more like the Bohra Dai but the bohras are bigger cowards than other muslims and hence the Dai doesn't need guns and beheadings to enslave them!!