Kuchh Ajeeb Manners , Tameez That I Remarked

[master.b00t]

My english is bad so me gujaratike hindi ma vaat karish.
2 varas pehla hu taher saifuddin maula na urus wakhte bombay mara dikra na sehra na kaam mate gayo hato mara wife ni ummid hati ke em thay to e mate ame gaya hata
to taher safuddin maula na roza ma daakhal thata pehla badha photao aave chhe to e me joy rahyo hato .. etli vaar ma ek bhai saab aavya ane mane kahe ke ..."Chal Chal Have Shu Chhe Phota Pachhi Joje Chal Have AAgal' Aamnu vartan joi ne hu to aabhoj bani gayo ane mane tarataj em thayu ke shu aa badha maula ni najik rehwa wala aatla badha "Cheap' hashe ana karta to comoon maans sadharan manas ghano saro hoy ... shu aa badha maulana ni waez ma je shikhamano maula aape chhe tene shu saambalta nahi hoy ke shu. pachhi hu andar t.s maula ni zyarat mate gayo to zaarat karwa samaye mane pachal gale thi pakadyo ane zaarat thay no thay tyan khenchi ne ek baaju kari didho jyan jaju public hoy ane badha loko nbe zarat no laabh devo hoy to jara jadap karvi pade ane ema loko e sahkaar aapvoj joiye pan aakharab vartan ane paachal thi gale thi janwar ne jem pakadiye em pakadwani shi jaroor. hamna me 10 divas pehlaaj jamnagar gayo hato to ame kadamboshi waste pass lay ne mawaid ma betha hata tyan ek voleenteer pani aapta hata ema ek jan ne pani aapyu pan e vaykti ne zara waar laagi tyan to voleenteer tene kahe chhe ke " Chal Chal Have Salwaat Pachhi Padje !!!! pehla pani jaldi thi pee " aa words saamb li ne hu to aabhoj bani gayo ke aa bhai potani duty barabar bajawava mate salwaat nu apmaan kari rahya chhe. doston vadilo ane mara pyara mumenin bhaio apne badhaaj mumenin pratye bhavna chhe pan aawi te koi rit ,padhati manners hoti hashe , shu maula ni najik ane ghanu manva wala aatla Ruf ane Cheap kem ? koi biradar ne bhule c huke dukh laage evu kahyu hoy to maaf karjo. mara lakhaan ma koi bhul chuk hoy ke samajwama taklif thay hoy to maaf karsho ane koi suchhan hoy to aapno nano bhai gani ne zaroor kehsho. thanks

[mumin]

brother master; fakat tamaro experience nai balke tamaam haqiqi progressive dawoodi insanyat bohri no bhi aaj experience che. abde to goonda no raj che ke jem bani tem har ek tarika se bas paisa banavo ane aram se raho and mumineeno ne bevakoof banavi ne paisa leva ni tarkeeb socho. aaj abde no dharam ane iman che.

[Smart]

Aa je manners ni vaat tame karocho, ane je kharab anubhav tamne avya chhe, e fakt nichena mansonaaj nathi. Aa riteno vyavhar to uparthij ave chhe.

Ek zamaano hato (so varas pehla) ke jyare maula sikhaman apta. Aaj na zamaana ma to fakt potani taarif and emnathi je sahmaat na hoy e saghla ne galo (laanat) devanoch karyakram hoy chhe. Kaya vaez ma tame sikhaman sambhli chhe?

Aa gandki uparthij utre chhe.

Emni naato ma pan gaalo bhareli hoy chhe. udaharan tarike, "jahannum ma hazaaron saal jalse aapna dushman". Khuda aa badha abde ne taufiq aape ane haq na rasta par chalvani aqal aape.

[saif]

Re: Visit to Raudat Tahera by Industrialist
by saif on Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:41 am

omabharti:

Re: "DID THEY ASK THEM TO WEAR SAYA AND TOPI AS IS REQUIRED OF BOHRAS".

This will answer your question indirectly. Real life example:

1. In 1997, I was part of a North American delegation to Mumbai as the guests of the Chief Minister of the Maharashtra Government.

One early morning, during the month of Ramadhan, I requested the driver of the Chief Minister to take me to Rodha Tahera whilst passing through the Bhindi Bazaar. I was in the Chief Minister's Oversize Ambassador Car, with his official banner flying/majestically ruffling outside the car and the driver resplendant in his official chauffeur attire and tunic. I was wearing my suit and the tie but I had my topi with me in the pocket.

The fajar namaz had just finished and people were coming out in draws. As soon as we reached the gate of the Roza, our driver got off in a hurry and opened the rear door to let me off.

When I got off, I duly put my topi on and proceeded to the gate. On the steps there was a Sheikh/Mulla on the steps. When he saw me get off and saw me put my Topi on, he shouted and excitedly called and requested "Abdul" to take my shoes off and lead me to the Roza.

"Abdul" immediately came and took my shoes, and screamed at the people coming out of the mosque and going to the Roza to make way for me and very ceremoniuosly and courteously led me to the Roza. I paid my respects (including putting money in the galaa) and came out and "abdul" returned my shoes and led me to the Chief Minister's car.

2. In 2001, I returned to Mumbai and Roza Tahera, this time with my family on a private visit. We arrived in our privately hired taxi.

I and the two males with me only had my Topi and Salwaar Khamis. The same Sheikh/Mulla who was there in 1997 during my previous visit was there at the gate.

As soon as he saw us in Topi and salwaar khamis, he screamed at us and told us in no uncertain terms that we would NOT be allowed to get in to the Roza without Saayas. We tried to borrow the sayaas from the people who had already finished with their respects but not one Bohri male volunteered to lend the saaya to us.

We left without paying our respects or depositing any moneys in the galaa.

Mind boggled!!!!

[Omega]

@ Saif

Salaam

dont you think in the first instance that Mulla saheb would have thought you are some government dignitary and has come to pay his respect, and as its customary and out of respect for local tradition that our politicians and some government officials wear our Topi when they come to our place, so a benefit of doubt should be given. and you have only mentioned that you were attired in a western dress and were in CM's car.


for second instance:

when you have gone to Ziyarat, didnt you knew that Saya kurta is necessary, and why will any one lend you thiers when every one is in hurry to rush to their job

[Smart]

Dear Bhai Saif,

The respect was not to you, but the power of the Government. Look at the top bosses. Even the Syedna genuflects before Modi, the chief Minister of Gujarat. Common Bohras are treated like milch cows, valued till they give milk (moolah) and then lead to the slaughter house, when they become unable to provide.

[Human]

@ Saif

for second instance:

when you have gone to Ziyarat, didnt you knew that Saya kurta is necessary, and why will any one lend you thiers when every one is in hurry to rush to their job

For saaya, I keep on asking why has it become compulsory? In the past it wasn't compulsory. I remember being able to go for ziyarat in just kurta (with pant was allowed too) and shirt pant was fine too. The only compulsory thing was topi. The rule was, all decent clothes were allowed and all that was needed was topi. Why has this changed over the years? Are we going backwards when the rest of the world is sprinting ahead?

[Omega]

Bro Human,

Salaam

if wearing a western dress is your concern then i cant comment more as its a personnel wish.

but every place needs some decorum and a uniformity in outlook. just compare the look of all people in Saya kurta and all in a western dress present in a roza, just be true to yourself and speak which will be more appealing to eyes

[Human]

Omega,
Wearing a western dress now and forcing my way in the roza to do ziyarat is not my concern. My concern is, why were we more liberal before say for example in 1980s or 1990s and why become strict all of a sudden.

I disagree with your comment that every place needs uniformity. Imposing a uniform could be considered a 'cult-like' activity. If someone wore indecent clothes like shorts and singlets then I'm all for not letting them in, but if a person is wearing shirt pant (no in-shirt) with a topi or a kurta with a topi without a saaya, why stop him? It is not disrespectful in anyways, is it?

About your last point, I do not think if something is appealing to eyes or not should matter at all at a place where we go to pay respect to the people who have passed away. Like saif mentioned above, he was not allowed along with his family to enter the roza; it is wrong. A uniformity in clothes reminds me of school where one has to follow the rules laid down by the principal or of Hitler's soldiers who had to dress up in the Nazi khakhi alongwith the NAZI scarf on their arm and that was compulsory all the time!

[Omega]

Omega,
Wearing a western dress now and forcing my way in the roza to do ziyarat is not my concern. My concern is, why were we more liberal before say for example in 1980s or 1990s and why become strict all of a sudden.

Why dont we take it in a more positive way, as the community is evolving they are being made aware about their identity, though i disagree that nothing is called Islamic dress but then also a uniformity gives more of a feeling of brotherhood, which is a accepted practice all over the world.

I disagree with your comment that every place needs uniformity. Imposing a uniform could be considered a 'cult-like' activity. If someone wore indecent clothes like shorts and singlets then I'm all for not letting them in, but if a person is wearing shirt pant (no in-shirt) with a topi or a kurta with a topi without a saaya, why stop him? It is not disrespectful in anyways, is it?

NO, going to a Roza in Pant shirt is not disrespectful, but you will agree that we have a norm of wearing appropriate dress according to the occasion. like a party and office wear differs, why not a dress for going to do ziyarat also


About your last point, I do not think if something is appealing to eyes or not should matter at all at a place where we go to pay respect to the people who have passed away. Like saif mentioned above, he was not allowed along with his family to enter the roza; it is wrong. A uniformity in clothes reminds me of school where one has to follow the rules laid down by the principal or of Hitler's soldiers who had to dress up in the Nazi khakhi alongwith the NAZI scarf on their arm and that was compulsory all the time!

OK lets not get into things appealing to eyes, appeal differs from a person to person's perspective on how they perceive things. Dont oppose some positive change in the community just for the sake of opposition, try to see that people are now more on a same page rather every one having thier own style

[Human]

Omega,
If you beleive this is a positive change then I have a difference of opinion, but its fine since you mentioned in another thread that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

Taking it a step further, why are we now asked to wear kurta and especially topi everywhere in our normal lives and rida for women has become utterly compulsory. Going for ziyarat and maintaining the respect and dignity is okay, but why the force for our normal lives? I don't say this is bad but why the force? If people like it, they do it with their true heart. If they do not prefer to do it, then why ask them to do it? Then there's also the matter of us being asked to keep long dadhis or considerately visible dadhi atleast, why? This wasn't the case 20 yrs ago. Why do I now look like an alien and people stare at me when I go to masjid and do not have dadhi? Why does the aamil stare me down with killer eyes and give me a taunt just because I don't keep dadhi. I personally don't beleive dadhi should be a compulsion. It is another practice of isolating the members of the community which is also a cult-like practice.
If one wants to keep dadhi because they are happy to do so is fine but why force others?

[master.b00t]

This is not important that what "Islaam" says, this is our bohri different dharam that created by Dai.

[Omega]

Brother Human,

i agree that sometimes overzealous nature of Tanzeem people and sometimes of Aamil might look like too much for a trivial issue to some. but when we look at it from another view point they are just asking you to follow Sunnah of Rasullalah (saw), what's the harm in it. And as every one has started keeping a beard so few who dont keep are just odd man out. I agree force should not be used, as Tawfeek is Allah's prerogative, whom he gives its his choice.


As far as Rida is concerned, Islam advocates modest dressing and Rida fulfills that and gives a distinct identity to our women. if some one has a issue with it they are very much liberal to dress what they deem fit or good for them

[SBM]

As far as Rida is concerned, Islam advocates modest dressing and Rida fulfills that and gives a distinct identity to our women. if some one has a issue with it they are very much liberal to dress what they deem fit or good for them

So Omega
Here is another question for you, Since France has outlawed Hijab and Rida is another form of Hijab, Is Kothar going to fight President Sarkozy and their Parliament to allow. Seweden has outlawed Minarets and all Bohra Mosque have to have Minaret as per Fatimid Architecture so how would you handle that.
SHOULD DAWOODI BOHRAS BE ASKED TO LEAVE FRANCE AND SWEDEN AND COME BACK TO TANZANIA OR INDIA OR PAKISTAN OR DUBAI?

[S. Insaf]

Dear brother omega,
Do Dawoodi Bohras have any choice now-a-days? Where is freedom for us? There was no interfrence of Tanzeems or Aamils, no restriction of Jamat-cards and dress code before the mass revolt in Udaipur in 1973. Every human being born in this world including the Bohra Dai was born without cloths. Cloths were invented by man after remaining naked for thousands of years. Then cloths were designed according to the climate in each region. It has nothing to do with religion.
Rida or Burqa in Arab was necessary both for men and women to protect them from desert sand and storm. Men even used to tie a rope around the head to protect the head. The practice of Vazoo five times before each prayer was introduce to clean the parts of the body affected due to sand and a bath every Friday because of scarcity of water in desert of Arabia. As time passed and situation improved and when Islam spread outside Arab men most conveniently gave away Rida but kept on imposing on women.
Bohras were one but they all had different dresses according to the regions they came from, Kathyawadi, Ujjaini, Haiderabadi, Rajasthani etc. The community was like a Guldasta (bouquet of flowers of different kinds), not like several dead bodies covered in white kaffan.
Now it is very difficult to reverse it as making clourful designers Rida and dresses has taken a shape of big industry and many are thriving on it.
1400 years back Razor blades were not invented and keeping beard was a necessity of the time. Who would now like to look like brute!

Similarly the practice of burial or burning a dead body was in practice due to dehherent environmental conditions/science. In desert wood was hard to find. It was easy to push aside sand and bury the dead body in it. The dead body then used to burn down inside the burning heat of desert. Christians used a wooden coffin but the prophet of Islam did not want to waste even that much available wood. So he instructed to burry the dead body in plain cloths. Just imagine the trouble and time taken in digging a grave in the hard land like India and then allow it to rot for a long time inside the grave, where plenty of wood is available! Therefore all the religions, Jews, Christians, Muslims etc. from desert they bury their dead where as all the religions outside Arabia burn their dead. There is no religion in all these practices.

[Al Zulfiqar]

Brother Human,
i agree that sometimes overzealous nature of Tanzeem people and sometimes of Aamil might look like too much for a trivial issue to some. but when we look at it from another view point they are just asking you to follow Sunnah of Rasullalah (saw), what's the harm in it. And as every one has started keeping a beard so few who dont keep are just odd man out. I agree force should not be used, as Tawfeek is Allah's prerogative, whom he gives its his choice.
As far as Rida is concerned, Islam advocates modest dressing and Rida fulfills that and gives a distinct identity to our women. if some one has a issue with it they are very much liberal to dress what they deem fit or good for them

sunnah of islam is to dress modestly, not put people in uniforms because it looks good. whatever is being followed in our community today is by force, so stop pretending that we have free choice. the only choice you have if you do not obey is to leave or get kicked out.

what looks like a trivial issue to you is part of a much wider strategy to enslave this community and manipulate them, loot them and brainwash them into believing that dai is above any accountability, is representing allah and is divine. all of which is hogwash. i repeat once again, please read the first thread on this forum, read our history and scriptures and then come armed with knowledge to debate. we welcome everyone on this board, but not so that they keep trying to push the nefarious agenda of the kothar.

[Mubarak]

Dear brother omega,
Do Dawoodi Bohras have any choice now-a-days? Where is freedom for us? There was no interfrence of Tanzeems or Aamils, no restriction of Jamat-cards and dress code before the mass revolt in Udaipur in 1973. Every human being born in this world including the Bohra Dai was born without cloths. Cloths were invented by man after remaining naked for thousands of years. Then cloths were designed according to the climate in each region. It has nothing to do with religion.
Rida or Burqa in Arab was necessary both for men and women to protect them from desert sand and storm. Men even used to tie a rope around the head to protect the head. The practice of Vazoo five times before each prayer was introduce to clean the parts of the body affected due to sand and a bath every Friday because of scarcity of water in desert of Arabia. As time passed and situation improved and when Islam spread outside Arab men most conveniently gave away Rida but kept on imposing on women.
Bohras were one but they all had different dresses according to the regions they came from, Kathyawadi, Ujjaini, Haiderabadi, Rajasthani etc. The community was like a Guldasta (bouquet of flowers of different kinds), not like several dead bodies covered in white kaffan.
Now it is very difficult to reverse it as making clourful designers Rida and dresses has taken a shape of big industry and many are thriving on it.
1400 years back Razor blades were not invented and keeping beard was a necessity of the time. Who would now like to look like brute!

Similarly the practice of burial or burning a dead body was in practice due to dehherent environmental conditions/science. In desert wood was hard to find. It was easy to push aside sand and bury the dead body in it. The dead body then used to burn down inside the burning heat of desert. Christians used a wooden coffin but the prophet of Islam did not want to waste even that much available wood. So he instructed to burry the dead body in plain cloths. Just imagine the trouble and time taken in digging a grave in the hard land like India and then allow it to rot for a long time inside the grave, where plenty of wood is available! Therefore all the religions, Jews, Christians, Muslims etc. from desert they bury their dead where as all the religions outside Arabia burn their dead. There is no religion in all these practices.

Dear brother Insaf sahib,

In your fight with corrupt Burhanuddin sahib and his parasite family do not forget that your first and foremost loyalty is with the shariyat/practice of Dawoodi Bohras.

The first dictum of Bohra Youth (Progressives) is that that their religious faith is ditto like Shabab i.e. Dawoodi Bohra Ismailiya Shia. You hold some post in our community, if above expressed, unambiguous dictum is unacceptable to you then you have no moral to hold that post otherwise DO NOT ATTACK OUR BOHRAS FAITH.

Do as Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) or his authorized appointee did.

Growing beard is practice of Prophet and to follow the same is sunnat-a-Rasool. If you do not wish to grow beard it is your choice but do not attack this sunnat.

Burying dead is the practice per Islam beginning from the time of Aadam (a.s.) his son and first martyr of world Molana Habeel (a.s.) was buried, Prophet Mohammed (a.s.), Mola Ali (a.s.), Dai-ul-Balagh Molana Fakhruddin (Galiyakot) was buried, Dai-a-Mutlaq Molana Qutubuddin (Ahmedabad) was buried – you are advocating to burn dead bodies this is against Bohras faith!!!

You must give disclaimer that these are your personal thoughts and has no bearing of faith of Bohra Youth / Central Board.

[anajmi]

1400 years back Razor blades were not invented and keeping beard was a necessity of the time. Who would now like to look like brute!

That is an extremely ignorant statement to make. The prophet's hadith is to trim the moustache and grow the beard. How were those people supposed to trim moustaches if no razor blades were invented? And why the emphasis on growing beards if the people didn't have an option?

That post of your puts an big question mark on every post of yours where you have quoted the quran and the sunnah of the prophet to oppose the acts of the the corrupt Dai. It was extremely hypocritical.

[Humsafar]

Insaf saheb is technically corret. Keeping a beard was a norm in those days. But more to the point, the beard is a cultural thing and was part of Prophet's culture - hence the suunah. Beard itself has nothing to do with Islam. The prophet did not keep the beard because he was required to do so by God. It is important to focus on the sunnah but on those parts that really matter - like being honest, truthful etc. - and not on things which do not contribute to being a good Muslim one way or the other.

[S. Insaf]

My above post is for those who are hardcore orthodox in their thinking and consider customs and traditions as part of religion. Sayedna Saheb's establishment has made loyalty to Dai, his raza in each every thing, making him absolute owner and sole trustees of community’s properties, dress code and others in the name of "900 years-old Dawoodi Bohra customs and traditions.”
I am not advocating anything against any religion revealed or otherwise, but trying to emphasis that each religion or faith can not escape the influence of the complex circumstances of its origin. The Quranic theology, as spelled out in the Holy Scripture, does not uphold the arbitrary divine intervention, Sharia theology notwithstanding.
Quran says "Have they never journeyed through the land? Have they no hearts to reason with, or no ears to hear with? It is their hearts, and not their eyes, that are blind."
Unfortunately the dress, growing beard, marriage, disposing off dead etc. which are social customs are made integral part of faith.
When Dawoodi Bohras got divided in to different sects each sect made changes in their caps, attire, and customs to look different from others. Sunnis were all sorts of dresses but Shia Asna Asharis, Bohras, Khoja though a part of Shia faith have made changes in their outlook and customs.

[Omega]

@ Insaaf Saheb,

SIr i think you are one of eldest of the people who reply on this forum. I also respect you for your differences though i belong to a different school of thought and in your words a hardcore Abde, but i have not been thaught to be rude just to prove my point.

Sir i think you have confused your self, as you can not distinguish between reform in Dawoodi Bohra sect as per se or reform in Islam as a whole. By your questioning, some of our basic tenets like marriage, beard, purdah, burrial of dead among few for which you have raised your concerns does not seem to align what is prescribed under Islam, and as already few have questioned your comments, kindly enlighten me with your position on these things.

[Al Zulfiqar]

Bhai Insaf,

I agree with you. equating religion with social traditions, customs and rituals is wrong and counter-productive. putting undue emphasis on them to the exclusion of the essence and intent of religion is getting unneccesarily caught up in trivialities and is the cause of the way islam is viewed today in pagan hardline societies like saudi arabia.

deen me dadhi hai, dadhi me deen nahi.

[anajmi]

The prophet did not keep the beard because he was required to do so by God.

And you know that how exactly? It was a rhetorical question. You know that because you think God does not exist. So it is hypocritical of you too make such a statement too. Not a single act of the prophet was without the permission of Allah or something that Allah did not like. So if the prophet has asked the believers to keep a beard then it is simply because that is what was approved by Allah. He didn't make it a fard and that should be enough of an argument for you to not keep a beard. Everything else involving razor blades and culture is your own bs.

[ghulam muhammed]

they are just asking you to follow Sunnah of Rasullalah (saw), what's the harm in it. And as every one has started keeping a beard so few who dont keep are just odd man out.

Agreed that keeping a beard is part of the sunnah of Rasul Allah (s.a.w.). Now I request you to honestly carry out a survey whereby at random you ask 10 dadhiwala bohras one simple question i.e. -- Why do you sport a beard ? After that tell me whether even one bohra says that he is doing it just because it is the sunnah of Prophet (s.a.w.). I bet you will get only one stereo typed answer-- "Aa to mola nu farman chhe etle hame dadhi raakhi chhe" which means they care a heck about the sunnah and their only focus and concern is what their mola says whether it is sunnah, unislamic or inhuman, they will follow only his diktats and no one elses.

[merchant786]

Omega,

Just one basic question for you which does not even involve the religious knowledge...

There are only 6 lakhs registered ejamaat card holders i.e bohras in the world now..The population at the time of 51st Dai was much more than that..Please explain me why the count has gone down..Agreed that there are some people who have joined the reform movement but even they are not more than 50000..where have the rest disappear???

[anajmi]

For those who believe that shaving wasn't possible 1400 years ago, here is the shaving timeline

http://www.quikshave.com/timeline.htm

[Omega]

by ghulam muhammed on Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:22 pm

Agreed that keeping a beard is part of the sunnah of Rasul Allah (s.a.w.). Now I request you to honestly carry out a survey whereby at random you ask 10 dadhiwala bohras one simple question i.e. -- Why do you sport a beard ? After that tell me whether even one bohra says that he is doing it just because it is the sunnah of Prophet (s.a.w.). I bet you will get only one stereo typed answer-- "Aa to mola nu farman chhe etle hame dadhi raakhi chhe" which means they care a heck about the sunnah and their only focus and concern is what their mola says whether it is sunnah, unislamic or inhuman, they will follow only his diktats and no one elses.

Brother Ghulam Muhammed,

Salaam

Their is no need to carry out a survey, what you say can be right in few individual's case. But again i repeat in the end result is that Rasulallah (saw) sunnah is getting followed. i totally agree that force should not be exerted and as i have said in one of the other post that tawfeeq is Allah subhanau tala's prerogative. And as far as Unislamic and inhuman practices is concerned just mention them and Inshallah we can have a discussion on them as well

[Omega]

by merchant786 on Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:09 pm

Omega,

Just one basic question for you which does not even involve the religious knowledge...

There are only 6 lakhs registered ejamaat card holders i.e bohras in the world now..The population at the time of 51st Dai was much more than that..Please explain me why the count has gone down..Agreed that there are some people who have joined the reform movement but even they are not more than 50000..where have the rest disappear???

Brother Merchant786

Salaam

I am really amazed at your knowledge about the data base of Dawoodi bohra's. looks like some insiders job but believe me the population is somewhere near 12 lacs. now if you dont believe me ask your source of the first info for a city wise population which i am sure he will be able to provide. And i really doubt that declared reformists are any thing but more than 12-15 thousand. i am not taking count of people who still hold thier Ejamat card dear to their heart and talk of reforms. So the number's speak for themself

[merchant786]

by merchant786 on Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:09 pm

Omega,

Just one basic question for you which does not even involve the religious knowledge...

There are only 6 lakhs registered ejamaat card holders i.e bohras in the world now..The population at the time of 51st Dai was much more than that..Please explain me why the count has gone down..Agreed that there are some people who have joined the reform movement but even they are not more than 50000..where have the rest disappear???

Brother Merchant786

Salaam

I am really amazed at your knowledge about the data base of Dawoodi bohra's. looks like some insiders job but believe me the population is somewhere near 12 lacs. now if you dont believe me ask your source of the first info for a city wise population which i am sure he will be able to provide. And i really doubt that declared reformists are any thing but more than 12-15 thousand. i am not taking count of people who still hold thier Ejamat card dear to their heart and talk of reforms. So the number's speak for themself

Beleive me its only 6 lakhs ...This is been confirmed by the kothar and its a valid figure known to all Aamils...You can try talking to your Aamil to find it out ...

There has been a constant decrease in the count of people from europe,USA & parts of maharashtra ...I think this detailed information is more than enough...

[Omega]

Beleive me its only 6 lakhs ...This is been confirmed by the kothar and its a valid figure known to all Aamils...You can try talking to your Aamil to find it out ...

There has been a constant decrease in the count of people from europe,USA & parts of maharashtra ...I think this detailed information is more than enough...


@merchant786

Brother you said its confirmed by Kothar, i have never come across any such announcement. if you have any thing which can prove the same kindly provide as this will provide me something of substance to refute my Aamil/source claim of 12 lac Dawoodi Bohra's. and regarding the downfall in numbers from Europe USA and Parts of Maharashtra again some irrefutable document will be much appreciated other wise people whom i will ask will deny as off course you will understand