Molae Raj (r.a.) v/s Shri Burhanuddin

[Mubarak]

Molae Raj (r.a.) was icon for attending all five prayers with strict time punctuality.

One day, very small unfinished matter in his course of work was left and time to prayer started, he thought that such small portion is left so let him finish this and then will jump in prayers.

For getting ablution water when he dropped dole in well, instead of water diamonds, Gold and precious stones came up in the dole. He threw them all back in well, kept none with himself and asked for Allah's pardon, made a second attemt but same and after third attemt of throwing all diamonds / stones / gold back in well, "I do not want diamonds / gold for myself, I need water to offer salat", Allah showered mercy and pardon on Molae Raj (r.a.).

True officers of pristine Fatimi Dawat do not like diamonds/gold for themselves like Molae Raj (r.a.), whereas Shri Burhanuddin s/o Taher Saifuddin character is exactly opposite of Molae Raj (r.a.)!!!

Kothar/Burhanuddin saheb caught for smuggling Daimonds - what characterless and anti- Fatimi Dawat people are Kothar / Burhanuddin!!!!

[Aarif]

br. Mubarak,

With due respect but this sound like a fairy tale.
Is there any historic evidence that this jewels thing happened for real?

[Mubarak]

br. Mubarak,

With due respect but this sound like a fairy tale.
Is there any historic evidence that this jewels thing happened for real?

Brother Aarif,

By same token, will you also label Prophet Mohammed bifurcating moon as fairy tale!?

In Dawat-a-zul-asheera, the first public invitation of Prophet Mohammed (s.a.), where just ONE small cup of milk had filled stomachs of all participants - each one of those could drink scores of those cups and still demand more: will u label this also as fairy tale?

Prophet Christ with his touch can give eyes to blind, cure white-patch illness, made alive the dead ones - why not will u lable this also as fairy tale?

Prophet Dawood with his bare hands can twist iron and fly in air!

Per Quran: Jinns servicing Dawood - perfect fairy tales isn't it?

[anajmi]

Mubarak,

You ignored Aarif's question. What is the evidence? As in, which book does this get mentioned in? Then we will figure out if what is stated in that book can be trusted or not.

[Mubarak]

Mubarak,

You ignored Aarif's question. What is the evidence? As in, which book does this get mentioned in? Then we will figure out if what is stated in that book can be trusted or not.

Evidence is Fatimi Dawat books / Majlises.

You cannot use word "we" for yourself or yours like, this is Bohras Forum and "we" stands for Dawoodi Bohras and you are anti-Dawoodi Bohras.

We (i.e. Bohras) don't need vetting by you - to adjudge which of ours books to be trusted or otherwise.

You are from camp of Aaisha, the enemy of Mola Ali (a.s.) who came to fight against Mola Ali (a.s.) and we (i.e Bohras) are from camp of Mola Ali (a.s.).

So, don't use "we" for u.

[anajmi]

Mubarak,

Which Fatimid Books? Fairy Tales? Available in the "Fiction" section of the library? Attacking me is not going to get me off your back. I will be following you on every thread till you start backing up your claims like halal animals performing ruku and sujood with pictures. When I say "we", I mean those who have enough sense not to get fooled by your "pristine" claims.

[Mubarak]

Mubarak,

Which Fatimid Books? Fairy Tales? Available in the "Fiction" section of the library? Attacking me is not going to get me off your back. I will be following you on every thread till you start backing up your claims like halal animals performing ruku and sujood with pictures. When I say "we", I mean those who have enough sense not to get fooled by your "pristine" claims.

The action of Sunni's from Ruku to Sujood mirrors that of haram animals (Pig, Dog, etc) action from standing to sitting.

The action of Bohras from Ruku to Sujood mirros that of halal animals (Goat, Camel, etc) action from standing to sitting.

Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) action by default will mirror that with halal than haram animals.

[anajmi]

I have never seen a pig or a dog or Goat or a camel do ruku or sujood. Fortunately, as per Sunni beliefs, ruku and sujood was taught to the prophet by Jibraeel (as) and not by goats and camels as per idiotic shia beliefs.

[anajmi]

Let me correct myself. I don't think all shias believe this way. Only those that have "pristine" understanding.

My question remains, which Fatimid Book talks about Molae Raj?

[porus]

I have never seen a pig or a dog or Goat or a camel do ruku or sujood.

I don't know about those particular animals, but the elephant has definitely been reported to have done sujood to Sayedna after being sent off by by him to jannat.

anajmi, I suggest you give this dialog a miss!

[ghulam muhammed]

I don't know about those particular animals, but the elephant has definitely been reported to have done sujood to Sayedna after being sent off by by him to jannat.

Bro Porus,

Very well said.

[anajmi]

We need to figure out if the elephant performed the goat/camel sujood or the pig/dog sujood. Or if the elephant sujood was a distinct sujood?

The we need to see if Fatimid Books provide clues as to how animals did sujood to Molae Raj.

[Mubarak]

I have never seen a pig or a dog or Goat or a camel do ruku or sujood. Fortunately, as per Sunni beliefs, ruku and sujood was taught to the prophet by Jibraeel (as) and not by goats and camels as per idiotic shia beliefs.

ANajmi,

Be intellectual honest to accept wrong in your Sunni belief. Don't answer just for sake of answer when your answers don't really answer.

Re-read the underlying part below, it says the action of haram:halal animals from standing to sitting and NOT animals per se doing ruku/sujood mirros Sunni:Bohras action from Ruku to Sujood.

The action of Sunni's from Ruku to Sujood mirrors that of haram animals (Pig, Dog, etc) action from standing to sitting.

The action of Bohras from Ruku to Sujood mirros that of halal animals (Goat, Camel, etc) action from standing to sitting.

Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) action by default will mirror that with halal than haram animals.

[like_minded]

You cannot use word "we" for yourself or yours like, this is Bohras Forum and "we" stands for Dawoodi Bohras and you are anti-Dawoodi Bohras.

We (i.e. Bohras) don't need vetting by you - to adjudge which of ours books to be trusted or otherwise.

You are from camp of Aaisha, the enemy of Mola Ali (a.s.) who came to fight against Mola Ali (a.s.) and we (i.e Bohras) are from camp of Mola Ali (a.s.).

So, don't use "we" for u.

Mubarak

We talk about muslim unity and here you are .... bent on division! You should be ashamed of yourself for such comments!

[Mubarak]

You cannot use word "we" for yourself or yours like, this is Bohras Forum and "we" stands for Dawoodi Bohras and you are anti-Dawoodi Bohras.

We (i.e. Bohras) don't need vetting by you - to adjudge which of ours books to be trusted or otherwise.

You are from camp of Aaisha, the enemy of Mola Ali (a.s.) who came to fight against Mola Ali (a.s.) and we (i.e Bohras) are from camp of Mola Ali (a.s.).

So, don't use "we" for u.

Mubarak

We talk about muslim unity and here you are .... bent on division! You should be ashamed of yourself for such comments!

Like_Minded,

Begin with beginning to make your Sunni house in order by fixing Anajmi when he writes: "idiotic shia beliefs".

[anajmi]

Mubarak,

action of haram:halal animals from standing to sitting

So how do halal animals go from standing to sitting? Bend their legs and put their butts on the floor? How do haram animals go from standing to sitting? Bend their legs and put their butts on the floor. Sunnis have two legs and two hands so they cannot go from standing to sitting like animals. Animals are on all four when they are standing. When humans are standing, they are on two legs only. When humans go to ruku, they are still on their two feet.

I don't think anybody has an idea what you are talking about. Can you draw some pictures? Did your dawoodi bohra teachers use goats to demonstrate how to go from ruku to sujood?

[like_minded]

Like_Minded,

Begin with beginning to make your Sunni house in order by fixing Anajmi when he writes: "idiotic shia beliefs".


Mubarak

Beliefs are beliefs... whether its shia beliefs or sunni beliefs or bohra beliefs... they are not facts... and we are fools to attack each other on the subject to prove which belief is better!

Shame on us!

[Mubarak]

Mubarak,

action of haram:halal animals from standing to sitting

So how do halal animals go from standing to sitting? Bend their legs and put their butts on the floor? How do haram animals go from standing to sitting? Bend their legs and put their butts on the floor. Sunnis have two legs and two hands so they cannot go from standing to sitting like animals. Animals are on all four when they are standing. When humans are standing, they are on two legs only. When humans go to ruku, they are still on their two feet.

I don't think anybody has an idea what you are talking about. Can you draw some pictures? Did your dawoodi bohra teachers use goats to demonstrate how to go from ruku to sujood?

All Halal animals action from standing to sitting position is: they will first touch their front leg elbow/knee (I mean the central part of their leg) on ground, and after that their back legs knees will touch ground.

All Haram animals action from standing to sitting positions will be in reverse order of above.

Bohras action from Ruku to Sujood is they will first touch their elbow/plam on ground and after that their knees, mirroring action of all Halal cattles like Goat and Camel.

Sunni's action from Ruku to Sujood is they first touch their knees on ground and after that their elbow/palm, mirroring all Haram animals like Pig and dogs.

Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) action from ruku to sujood will mirror with halal cattles action from standing to sitting position than with haram animals. Thus, Bohras follow Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) and Sunni's don't.

[aqs]

@Mubarak,

You regurly dish out choicest of abuse and filth against Syedna(Tus) and then want your self to be counted a Dawoodi Bohra also. Man you seriously need some help, try to visit a Psychic may be he can be of some help.

[Mubarak]

@Mubarak,

You regurly dish out choicest of abuse and filth against Syedna(Tus) and then want your self to be counted a Dawoodi Bohra also. Man you seriously need some help, try to visit a Psychic may be he can be of some help.

Dear Mumin brother Aqs,

Refer to link: http://dawoodi-bohras.com/forum/viewtop ... f=1&t=5013

Your 'jodidar' Omega ran away, why don't you give a try with help of mighty Kothar power to counter the matter of above link.

Once you are done with above link then in the light of it we will see if Burhanuddin saheb to be considered as Dawoodi Bohra or not?

All the best,

Mubarak

[seeker110]

Shri Burhanuddin will need a bigger bucket

[anajmi]

Mubarak,

From standing to sitting, the animals front legs are already on the ground. Are you comparing the central part of the animals legs to the palms of human hands? Did you know that Dawoodi bohras eat a lot of kharas and mithas and hence fart like haraam animals (pigs)?

[anajmi]

Besides, when I personally go from ruku to sujood, my hands first touch the ground and then my knees. And I am sure most people do it this way. Also, most Sunni actions are based upon how the prophet did it and it has nothing to do with how halal or haram animals did it. The prophet prayed with his hands to his sides and with his hands folded in front of him. However, he was more used to praying with his hands folded in front of him. Even Hazrat Ali prayed that way. When you are standing in front of the Lord, which is more humble? hands folded in front or hands to the side?

[anajmi]

And also, you forgot to give a reference to the Fatimid Book that talks about Molae Raj.

[Mubarak]

Mubarak,

From standing to sitting, the animals front legs are already on the ground. Are you comparing the central part of the animals legs to the palms of human hands? Did you know that Dawoodi bohras eat a lot of kharas and mithas and hence fart like haraam animals (pigs)?

Anajmi,

From your own statemet it seems you have excellent experience of Pigs fart so you are personally contending above.

I understand u r unable to defend defenceless Sunni believes.

All Halal animals action from standing to sitting position is: they will first touch their front leg knees on ground, and after that their back legs knees will touch ground.

All Haram animals action from standing to sitting positions will be in reverse order of above.

Bohras action from Ruku to Sujood is they will first touch their elbow/plam on ground and after that their knees, mirroring action of all Halal cattles like Goat and Camel.

Sunni's action from Ruku to Sujood is they first touch their knees on ground and after that their elbow/palm, mirroring all Haram animals like Pig and dogs.

Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) action from ruku to sujood will mirror with halal cattles action from standing to sitting position than with haram animals. Thus, Bohras follow Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) and Sunni's don't.

[Mubarak]

Besides, when I personally go from ruku to sujood, my hands first touch the ground and then my knees. And I am sure most people do it this way. Also, most Sunni actions are based upon how the prophet did it and it has nothing to do with how halal or haram animals did it. The prophet prayed with his hands to his sides and with his hands folded in front of him. However, he was more used to praying with his hands folded in front of him. Even Hazrat Ali prayed that way. When you are standing in front of the Lord, which is more humble? hands folded in front or hands to the side?

That is u personally that's why. I guess u r coming from Bohra background so u still u have our fragrance like empty perfume bottle smells even with no perfume in it.

The Sunni in general have practive to touch first their knees on ground then their palm/elbow.

All Islam sects are in unison that Salat is pillar of Isalm and 'Haiya alal falah' - i.e. it demands one best attention.

Sunni while standing in Namaz widens their legs like milatry of any nation does in state of relax ('vishram' in hindi).

Bohras while standing in Namaz bring both legs close to each other like milatry of any nation does in state of attention ('Sawdhan' in hindi).

Thus, Bohras offers Salat in state of attention attention whereas Sunni attend Salat in state of relax.

[anajmi]

Mubarak,

Allah created Man as the supreme being and then Dawoodi Bohras ended up immitating goats and camels to pray to Allah. What an unfortunate turn of events. Instead of saying that "We follow Rasulallah (saw)" idiots end up saying "We follow goats and camels". What more can I say? You keep following goats and camels, and we will follow the prophet of Allah.

Standing in Salaah has nothing to do with military positions. People spread their legs so that they can stand feet to feet and shoulder and shoulder. Bohras stand alone in Salaah in their own masallas even when they are in the masjid. The only time they are shoulder to shoulder and feet to feet is when they are stuffing themselves in thaals. I am sure you can reference the animal.

[master.b00t]

Agree with anajmi, agar sirat achhi ho lekin dil me luchaiya chhipi ho to wo pray kisi kaam nahin, kaise uthe baithe ye mahetwa ka nahin he , pray mahtwa ki he.

[Mubarak]

Mubarak,

Allah created Man as the supreme being and then Dawoodi Bohras ended up immitating goats and camels to pray to Allah. What an unfortunate turn of events. Instead of saying that "We follow Rasulallah (saw)" idiots end up saying "We follow goats and camels". What more can I say? You keep following goats and camels, and we will follow the prophet of Allah.

Standing in Salaah has nothing to do with military positions. People spread their legs so that they can stand feet to feet and shoulder and shoulder. Bohras stand alone in Salaah in their own masallas even when they are in the masjid. The only time they are shoulder to shoulder and feet to feet is when they are stuffing themselves in thaals. I am sure you can reference the animal.

Anajmi,

U are not intellectually honest.

Refer to my second last thread, I wrote in Red Bold letters that we Dawoodi Bohras follow Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) and Sunnis doesn't.

Bohras and Sunni's both claim that they truely follows Prophet Mohammed (a.s.) and other party do not. We all possibly cannot now arrange for a situation where Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) comes and tells who follow him right and who do not.

Given this state of affaris how can we determine whose approach/action of offering Salat is right?

One way to answer above question is to benchmark ones action against pre-established COMMON right/wrong categories. One such common category between Bohras and Sunni's is that of halal and haram animals.

As we have contended that Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) may not possibly will come on this Forum or among our gathering to adjudge who follows him correctly thus in this helpless situation when we wish to determine whose action/approach in Salat is right - we benchmarked both Bohras and Sunni's action against the pre-established common category of halal and haram animals action from standing to sitting.

In above test, we unambigously deduce that Bohras action resembles with Halal cattles and Sunni's action/approach in Salat resembles that of Haram animals.

Hence, it is more likely that Bohras approach/action in Salat are ditto copy of Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) and Sunni's approach/action in Salat is least likely to be like Prophet Mohammed (s.a.).

[Muslim First]

here is
The Prophet's Prayer (saws)

From The beginning To The End As Though You See It

By: Shaikh Muhammad Naasir-ud-Deen Al-Albaani
Translated by: Usama ibn Suhaib Hasan

http://www.missionislam.com/knowledge/prayerprophet.htm

Here is how how went into Sajda

Going Down into the Sajdah on the Hands

http://www.qss.org/articles/salah/11.html#RTFToC2

"He used to place his hands on the ground before his knees."82
He used to instruct likewise, saying, When one of you performs sajdah, he should not kneel like a camel, but should place his hands before his knees.83

He also used to say, Verily, the hands prostrate as the face prostrates, so when one of you places his face (on the ground), he should place his hands, and when he raises it, he should raise them.84