Abid Adeeb, President of the Progressive Bohra Jamaat

[murtaza2152]

This is an interview given to Yoginder Sikand for NewAgeIslam.com, By Abid Adeeb, President of the Dawoodi Bohra Jamaat of Udaipur, and Vice-President of the Central Board of the Dawoodi Bohra Community, The international federation of reformist Bohras

Q:The Syedna is regarded by the Bohras as dai-e mutlaq, or absolute guide of the community, and you say that he is misusing this position to enrich himself. Is this a new development? Doesn't the very position of dai-e mutlaq lend itself to abuse because of the totalitarian powers that go with it?

A: The Bohras believe that before their 21st Imam went into seclusion, he established the institution of dai-e mutlaq to protect the community and to guide its affairs at a time when the Ismailis were being hounded by their Sunni opponents as heretics. In that historical context, the institution of dai played a key role in keeping the community together. It implied merely religious control, but the present Syedna's father, the 51st dai, Tahir Saifuddin, changed it to mean total control over every aspect of the Bohras' lives. He claimed to be 'the master of their lives and properties' (jan-o-mal ka malik)! And the present dai continues in that tradition set by his father. This is what we are against. We say that this is a total abuse of the position of dai, that this is a new innovation that has no sanction in our religion. What we are saying is that the Syedna has deviated from our religion, that we want the dai to be our religious leader but not to exceed the bounds of a dai, in accordance with the established principles of our faith. But the Syedna and his cronies persist in spreading misinformation about us, wrongly accusing us of being against religion, and of being heretics.

To set the record straight, corruption among the dais did not start with Syedna Burhanuddin. The story goes back to the 47th dai, Abdul Qadir Najmuddin, who established the hereditary rule of a single family that still continues. He was the great-grandfather of Burhanuddin. There are terrible stories alleging how he came to power by removing the 46th dai. Some even claim that the 46th dai was poisoned. Corruption and rampant nepotism began with Najmuddin, who filled the Kothar with his men.


http://dawoodi-bohras.com/news/838/52/O ... bid-Adeeb/


@REFORMISTS,
YOUR LEADER HAS GIVEN THIS INTERVIEW PUBLICLY ,
I HAVE HIGHLIGHTED IN RED,
WHAT DOES THIS IMPLY?

ADMIN DON’T DELETE THIS THREAD

[Humsafar]

He's implying nothing. He just stating historical realities which you abdes want to brush under the rug. The corruption did start with Dai Abdul Qadir Najmuddin - he is believed to have started doling out "sheikh" titles to undeserving people and thus began the trend of undermining the status of ulema in our community.

[labbaikyaHussain]

He's implying nothing. He just stating historical realities which you abdes want to brush under the rug. The corruption did start with Dai Abdul Qadir Najmuddin - he is believed to have started doling out "sheikh" titles to undeserving people and thus began the trend of undermining the status of ulema in our community.

can u tell me why do u want to follow a leader who is (nauzobillah)

unislamic
curropt
murderer
dictator

while the world is getting rid of such leaders why progs want to follow such a dai who posses all this qualities?

[progpigs]

ya you people can create your own sect!!!

and if like MAQBOOL/JC/ZULFIQAR you again start off, that why should you (reformist) leave and all tht bullshit..!! so here's the ans y YOU (REFOMIST) should be seperated!!

With the current leadership of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin (TUS).. There are about more then 900 000 or may be a million following him!! And wats ur figure compared to us??

Then who shuld leav? You or Us??

Please dont start with bullshit arguments and derail!!

ADMIN!! pls monitor that the discussion goes in the direction!! if not remove such posts!

[Al Zulfiqar]

With the current leadership of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin (TUS).. There are about more then 900 000 or may be a million following him!! And wats ur figure compared to us??

pee-pee,

with the current leadership of syedna MB you have only around 650,000 registered bohras following him, v/s 1.5 billion sunnis and over 200 million other shias. where is your figure compared to them??? so who is now following b.s. ??

[progpigs]

lol.. you shuld need to do your maths!! Where do you get your info from??? I have official figures from EJAMAAT DATABASE!!! 90xxxxx number is being allocated to the new subscribers!! (better not argue with me on tht, as you dont know where I work and whats my role in the community)

IDIOT.. try to understand what we are discussing upon!! We are discussing about us v/s you (reforms)!! we aint comparing any other sect (unlike you doo!!)

i told you i dont want IDIOTS derailing from topic!!! pls ADMIN again i advice you to MONITOR the posts CAREFULLY!! your leaving out some FOOLS!!

[murtaza2152]

He's implying nothing. He just stating historical realities which you abdes want to brush under the rug. The corruption did start with Dai Abdul Qadir Najmuddin - he is believed to have started doling out "sheikh" titles to undeserving people and thus began the trend of undermining the status of ulema in our community.

So it is clear that your Leader believes Dais after 46 were Dai Nazim......As they started corruption and did Amal contradictory to Rasulullah's SA shariat.....
(Nauzobillah)

[udrbohri]

Why go and refer history. How corruption came to our community is past.
Just see how corruption is prevailing in current regime. I must say this, how gulf and muslim countries had started raising there voice against there Monarchy Regime. I believe imonarchy is just against the democratic principal of Islam.
Sooner or later same will happen in your community.

[progpigs]

against the democratic principal of Islam

can you explain me how is ISLAM A DEMOCRATIC prespective?

[Humsafar]

So it is clear that your Leader believes Dais after 46 were Dai Nazim......As they started corruption and did Amal contradictory to Rasulullah's SA shariat.....
(Nauzobillah)

No, that is not clear at all. It is your interpretation.

[Bigger]

ISLAM is democratic, Yes according to those laeen who form Sakeefa upon death of Rasul (SA) and chosen among one of them leaving ALI (AS) behind. Naapaak yeh je amal kidu aaje ehna bacchao bhi kare che.

Otherwise Rasul and AALE rasul, were all chosen by Allah only. not by public, If allah wanted democracy in this universe than he would have created whole universe at once and whole mankind instead of just creating ADAM (AS), but Allah's will was Taa'at of only for one. LA ilaha illallah

Like it was for Adam (AS), Like it was for Mohammad, Like it was for Hussain, Like it was for Imamuzzaman, Like it is For Dai allah il Ameen, Naa'ib Imamul Muttakeen.

[progpigs]

@Bigger:

well done with your explanation... i hope these fools get some ligth!!!

[Humsafar]

Bigger, take it easy man lest you choke on your own rhetoric. "udrbohri" used the phrase "islam's democratic principle" in the context of the oppression and injustice under the monarchs in the middle east. Islam is for justice, equality and compassion. And what the people of the Arab world are doing is in perfect accord with the Islamic principles. And what abdes should do - i.e. overthrow the tyranny of the kothar - would also be in perfect accord with the principles of Islam. When we reformist talk of democracy it is not about electing a dai or imam, it is about the autonomy of local jamaats. I wonder how many times we will have to repeat this until abdes understand this simple thing. Please try. It is not so hard.

[ghulam muhammed]

@REFORMISTS,
YOUR LEADER HAS GIVEN THIS INTERVIEW PUBLICLY ,
I HAVE HIGHLIGHTED IN RED,
WHAT DOES THIS IMPLY?

Bro murtaza2152,

You have delibarately pasted a part of the interview to anyhow prove that Abid and his likes do not recognise the current dai as 'dai-ul-mutlaq' and purposely not highlighted the other part which says the reverse of what you claim. I dont blame you for that because that is what your masters have also been doing 24x7...twisting, distorting and fabricating Islamic history to serve their ulterior motives and their hidden agendas. Now the consecutive statement given by Abid is as under :-

Q: If, as you allege, the present Syedna is so terribly oppressive and corrupt, why don't the reformists simply leave the Dawoodi Bohra community, especially given the fact that most Dawoodi Bohras, despite possibly being aware of all this, still regard him as their religious leader and so will probably not support your cause?

A: That is precisely what the Syedna wants, because if we take such a step we will cease to be Dawoodi Bohras and then shall have no standing or right to criticise his ways from within. In this way, Burhanuddin he can continue with his dictatorial and corrupt ways free of any internal pressure. We reformers are followers of our religious tradition and are pained to see how it is being misused. Why should we abandon our faith just because some people are misusing it? Instead of seceding from our community, like some dissenting groups have in the past, we want to reform it from within. That is why we say that we recognise Syedna Burhanuddin as the dai-e mutlaq, but we insist that he should not exceed the limits of the dai-e mutlaq by claiming, as he does, to be the 'master of our lives and property'. Instead, as in the case of the dais before the 47th dai, he should confine himself to purely religious roles. He must cease forthwith the un-Islamic taxes he imposes on us and the financial scandals, which have turned him and his vast family into billionaires. He should give us proper accounts as to how the enormous wealth that he earns from us is being used. He must also cease un-Islamic practices such as forcing Bohras to prostrate before him and claiming that if without his assistance or if we incur his wrath, Bohras will be doomed to hell. We refuse to stop speaking out because Islam tells us to stand up for what is right and true and to denounce oppression, even if some people wrongly seek to justify oppression in its name.

[murtaza2152]

@Humsafar,
It is far to understand Democracy, but You are not understanding a SIMPLE logic,
Reformists do not take name of 52 nd Dai in Dua,
Your Leader claims that Dai is corrupt and all evil practices are done by Dai,,
Yet he says that, reformists believe in Dai's Seat !!!
I think they beleive only in seat not the person authorized,
Bro why cant you understand this??
why r u denying it?

[progpigs]

coz bro murtaza,

they r MUNAFIQ & MUSHRIQ ... as decribed in prvs forums!

[murtaza2152]

@Gm,

At one breath Adib say all Dai after 46 Dai are corrupt, and at second he says that he believes in corrupted, doing non islamic acts Dai, 52 Dai as Dail Mutlaq,

Dai is corrupted, Doing non islamic acts ,So why believe him as Dail Mutlaq...??

[Bigger]

HS im very much comfortable and my knowledge of islam and its branches are very very humble and im always keen to enhance it from right source. May allah show me and my brothers correct path and help us understand his commands and will.(AAMEEN)

If the democracy was beneficial for our DAWAT, its culture and tradition thn all the chosen IMAM and DAI would have implemented it. That's my imaan. If in zamaan of past DAI it was prevailed than it was from allah's command and will, and If it is not implemented in our Zamaan, in this period thn indeed it is from Allah's command and will.

Moulana ALi (AS) lived life of ZOHOD and worn patched kameez and almost remain hungry in his Last ramzaan, all his deeds are uncomparable and unmatchable by any human. He was IMAM and in that particular period it was his AMAL.

Once Imam Jafar uss sadiq was in MAKKAH, one Wahabi very much read and big scholar of his time asked Imam (AS), why u always wear new and heavy clothes while ur ancestors have lived life of Zaheed, worn torn clothes as sign of fear of ALLAH, taqwa, hisaab and baiees. IMAM (AS) said, indeed allah is all knowing and forgiver of all sins, When my Ancestors (Peace be upon them) did that AMAL, it was their reign/period when they did so it was their hikmat and demand of their time, if im doing this, its My reign and demand of My period/reign is different from theirs, Truly for Mumin its the great eye opener answer of IMAM.
No two reign/period can be compared and thats why ALLAH kept one HADI/ man of Hidayat to help people of each and every period and every Zamaan. Have imaan in him and his sayings, thats the only way of salvation/ najaat. Else everything here is just the way of wasting efforts and getting confused

[Muslim First]

Bigger wrote

Once Imam Jafar uss sadiq was in MAKKAH, one Wahabi very much read and big scholar of his time asked Imam

Nice story brother. Was Abdul Wahab born before Imam Jafar?
He must be since his followers (Wahabis) were around to ask him question.

[Hussain_KSA]

Bigger wrote

Once Imam Jafar uss sadiq was in MAKKAH, one Wahabi very much read and big scholar of his time asked Imam

Nice story brother. Was Abdul Wahab born before Imam Jafar?
He must be since his followers (Wahabis) were around to ask him question.

Good Point brother muslim first

[Bigger]

read that wahabi as sunni.. My mistake.

But essence of story is set aside, focus on the moral.

[Muslim First]

read that wahabi as sunni.. My mistake.

That shows Wahabis are not far from your mind.

At that time Shiasm was let us say in gestation. Yet to be born later.

Imam Ja’far Sadiq was born on 17 Rabi-al Awwal 83 AH/ April 10 702 (Monday) and died on 25 Shawwal 148 AH/13 Dec 765 (Fri)
And
Imam Abu-Hanifa was born in 80 AH/699 and died in 150 AH/767 Baghdad

So Sunni Hanafi fiq was established long after the death of Imam Hanifa.

Instead of saying “one Wahabi very much read and big scholar of his time asked Imam” you could have just said "a learned Muslim Scholar of his time asked Imam”.

At that time there were no shias and no sunnis they were just Muslims.

You guys are just obsessed with Wahabis. Your priestly class just use it to spike the story (otherwise how can they keep abdes awake).

Anyway majority of Muslims are not even aware of loony toon cult of Dawoodi Bohras.

Next time do some reserch.

[progpigs]

read that wahabi as sunni.. My mistake.

That shows Wahabis are not far from your mind.

At that time Shiasm was let us say in gestation. Yet to be born later.

Imam Ja’far Sadiq was born on 17 Rabi-al Awwal 83 AH/ April 10 702 (Monday) and died on 25 Shawwal 148 AH/13 Dec 765 (Fri)
And
Imam Abu-Hanifa was born in 80 AH/699 and died in 150 AH/767 Baghdad

So Sunni Hanafi fiq was established long after the death of Imam Hanifa.

Instead of saying “one Wahabi very much read and big scholar of his time asked Imam” you could have just said "a learned Muslim Scholar of his time asked Imam”.

At that time there were no shias and no sunnis they were just Muslims.

You guys are just obsessed with Wahabis. Your priestly class just use it to spike the story (otherwise how can they keep abdes awake).

Anyway majority of Muslims are not even aware of loony toon cult of Dawoodi Bohras.

Next time do some reserch.

The split between SHIA & SUNNI was during the time when the 3 (L.A) FORCEFULLY took the power of Moula Ali (A.S) (appointed by Prophet in Gadheer) just when Prophet was on his death bed

So you do your research before you speak up

[Muslim First]

Poggy Piggy wrote

The split between SHIA & SUNNI was during the time when the 3 (L.A) FORCEFULLY took the power of Moula Ali (A.S) (appointed by Prophet in Gadheer) just when Prophet was on his death bed

And those Munafeekin Sunnis elected Hz Ali (Supposedly a hated person) their Khalif!!!!!

[Al Zulfiqar]

pee-pee,

now not only have abdes become total kafirs and mushriks, but also trying to re-write and distort history.

it is on record that ali never allowed any sajdas to him, he expressed extreme displeasure at those who sought to create divisions in islam and with disgust and laanats turned away those hundreds and thousands who were willing to form an army, equip it with weapons and horses to support ali so that he could seize his rights.

this was the greatness and wisdom of ali and he allowed the shia-sunni split in his lifetime??

laanats upon you and those like you who sully his life and his mission. you call yrself a shia of ali, but insult and degrade him?? forget about being a shia, you are not only not a muslim, but not even fit to be called a haiwan.

[progpigs]

oh is tht so...

then explain me the BATTLE OF CAMEL (JAMAL)

Why did Moula Ali had to fite and who were the enemies who stood against him???

Lets see wat u (MUSHRIQ & MUNAFIQ) knw about HISTORY..