When push comes to shove, 'Bohras are not Muslims'

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<br>It was reported in the English daily Indian Express and the Hindi daily Pratakal on 4 April 2002 that a group of Dawoodi Bohras in Gujarat claimed that they are "Not Hindus. No. Not Muslims either. They are Dawoodi Bohras caught in the crossfire.<p>"When the Maulana gives us any direction, we follow. When he asked us to return to business, we had to," said Shabbir Moiz Vohra, who set up shop in Kawant a week ago. <p>Shabbir suffered losses to the tune of Rs 6 lakh when his three shops were looted and burnt but did not accept any compensation, saying he would "be better off without it."<p>"We don't fear anything after hearing from the Maulana. We don't want to take revenge because we love peace," said Aliajgar Jainnudin Vohra, who has reopened one of his three damaged shops. <p>Both of them clarify that they "are not Muslims, but are Dawoodi Bohras." So does Nadir Badruddin Vohra. "We do break bread with them but marriages are taboo. They offer namaz five times a day, we do it only thrice; our mosques are also different," he stressed.<p>These Bohras claim that "When the Maulana gives us any direction, we follow." It is obvious that whatever they have said regarding their not being Muslims is as per dictates of Sayedna Saheb.<p>There is no corrective statement issued regarding this claim from Sayedna's side either. So one will take it as official statement of Sayedna that Dawoodi Bohras are not Muslims. <p>In fact any one who follows the basic principles of Islam and believes in Allah, His book the Qura'n and His Prophet, Mohammed (PBUH) is a Muslim. Dawoodi Bohras are very much believers of these three essentials and are, therefore Muslims. They also believe in Walayat of Hazrat Ali and therefore they are a sub-sect of Shia Muslims. They combine Zohar and Isha prayers and again Asar and Magrib prayers and pray five times prayers in three times. But they do observe all five prayers. Their mosques are known as masjids and not by any other name like temple, church or synagogues. They believe in five pillars of Islam, Wehdat, Salat, Zakat, Haj and Jihad. So it is wrong to say that they are not Muslims.<p>Being a business community it is true that by and large the Bohra community is a peace-loving community. It is unfortunate that their present religious heads have adopted a life of luxury and in order to amass wealth they have imposed several un-Islamic taxes and practices on the followers. In order that their followers do not mix with other Muslims and know the true Islam they make systematic efforts to assert on the minds of the followers that they are quite different than other Muslims.<p>But the hypocrisy of their religious leaders becomes evident when they order their followers to close down their bank accounts saying that the interest is prohibited for Muslims. Or when the Bohra religious head take pride in being the Chancellor of Alighar Muslim University. Or his representative being on the Central Haj Committee and Muslim Personal Law Board. They make announcements of their being the real well-wishers of the Muslim world. <p>But when the time comes for them to be accountable under Islamic law or Muslim Waqf Act, or to save their skin in a situation like in Gujarat now, they feel no shame in claiming that they are not Muslims.<p>Furthermore, the Dawoodi Bohras statements, presumably under instruction from Sayedna Saheb, that they are peace-loving is most dangerous under the present circumstances. Which directly implies that the other Muslims are not peace loving and they are trouble-makers.<p>Violent attacks on reformist Bohras time and again by fanatic followers of Sayedna and their proud and arrogant behaviour with other Muslims, cursing the Muslim Khalifas and creating riots, are for any one to judge how peace-loving these followers of Bohra high priest are? <p>It is the duty of Sayedna to immediately refute the statements made by his followers that they are not Muslims.<p>We also insist on Muslim organizations like Muslim Personal Law Board, Haj Committee, Aligarh Muslim University etc. to seriously note this contention on behalf of Sayedna Muhammed Burhanuddin.<p>http://www.dawoodi-bohras.com/chronicle ... ial.htm<br>

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The problem with Bohras is that they are very illiterate (religious wise) and sometimes with very little or no secular education.<p>Most bohra think Islam is another religion followed by Musalman, Sunni, Shia, Khoja ...etc <p>Most Bohras thinks they are God chosen people and that Dai is on the talking level with Al-mighty God.<p>That is why they are made to belief that they are not Muslim but they are dawoodi bohra. 'Technically' they are quite right. What they follow is the religion of Sayedna<br>

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Br Muslim: Present Syedna like his father is a very shrewd politician & plays his cards as the time dictates-He does not follow Islam either by the text as you know- Sis Jinx is right about the opinion on bohra massses-

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Br Muslim as you can read in this news Taht Syedna can pray in this non holy place but he will forbid his followers not to pray in the Sunni mosques- What a hypocrisy? Any comments Br Qiyam?Aqa maula tus proceeded for Ahmedabad railway station from Qutbi Mahal at 1820 Hrs. Police escort and escort from SVC was present. Thousands of Mumeneen and Mumenaat with their childeren were present ,crying and weeping.<p>At Railway station, Aqa Moula TUS stayed at Commanding Officers office and gave deedar to Thousands of mumeneen present at Railway station. At 1853 hrs Aaqa maula performed Namaaz with Imaamat in the office of Station Officer.<p>

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Br. Mhd. Hussain,<br>" but he will forbid his followers not to pray in the Sunni mosques- What a hypocrisy?"<p>--When Sayedna (tus) say a bohra cannot pray in any mosque? Yes you cannot pray as in imamat namaz niyyat (following the Imam)..but you can with the jamat.

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Mohd Hussain,<br>Your thinking is worse than a donkey. By calling Aqa Maula(tus) as a politician in a negative sense you have sold your salvation for a few moments of pleasure in this world. I swear by Allah that you will not be able to achieve najaat and you will keep having to live in this hayulaa. It is your sad fate that you have been blinded by the munafikeen's like Engineer.

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..tsk...tsk Huzaif...I thought you have some Kitab-e-Haqiqi to read.

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Br Huzaif: Let me tell you something -I tell you the facts as they are -I have not been blinded or brainwashed like you as I can think & react independently & Iam not going to become a donkey because a proven donkey says so & I am not afraid that I am not going to Jannat because some fanatic unlearned idiot says so!

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Well done huzeif,keep it up, we soon will know who the donkey is.You are right,as you say " By calling Aqa Maula(tus) as a POLITICIAN in a negative sense",MH should have refered to Aqa Moula as a positive POLITICIAN.<br>Br.Qiyam I have mentioned this before on this board, that my host in Karachi catagorically informed my dad not to offer namaazin the Jumma Masjit, and upon my inquiry as to why,I was informed that Moula has not given RAZA. Can you imagine we Bohras need RAZA even to offer namaaz?

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Mohd Husain,<br>You say you do not fear that you are going to jannat. I swear by Allah that you will be terrified on the Day of Judgement. The terror and horror which you will see in front of your eyes will make you frozen. That time will be too late to repent. All your false bravado will disapppear. Your great Engineer will ditch you. If you reflected a bit you would realize the consistency in Aqa Maula's(tus) life. Neither his direction nor his actions have changed. He is devoted to only one thing - to ensure that mumineen achieve najaat(salvation). His entire efforts serve this end. He gives 8 hours sabak everyday to his family members. Besides this,he has without fail given the barakat of ashara waaz. His life has been glorious. I pity those who criticise without having met him and been close to him. Certainly Satan is strong in this Daur us Satr. And people like you act as his hands and feet.<br>

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Hufaiz, your beliefs defy belief. I wonder if it's possible to be more gullible.

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Br Humsafar<br>What’s new? These people are from the school of Aqa Moula. Gullible, stupidity, extreme ignorance, brainwashed, thievery, morally corrupt, devoid of Islamic value and corrupt.<p>They will constantly brag about their Aqa Moula and their superior version of bohrisme & that Jannat crap while in the same breath cursing others.

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jinx,<br>People like u who are not well-versed in knowledge but are quick when it comes to putting others down will get the return for your evil deeds. You may like to defy me on this forum. You may have many friends. But even if I have no one I still have Allah with me while you don't. I have full faith in where I am going in the hereafter. While your mind is filled with doubt and viciousness. Certainly you will be unable to escape. I pity your pilght. Maulana Ali (AS) says - "I wonder at the plight of man who when the door of forgiveness is open to him does not repent." I urge you to meet me once.

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> But even if I have no one I still have Allah with me while you don't. I have full faith in where I am going in the hereafter.<p>huzaif,<p>The Prophet required that we put full faith in any who proclaim the shahadat. Islam is a brotherhood, and it is not for us to question the faith of other professed Muslims, only to teach them if we feel they are wrong. Not even the Prophet himself publicly labeled believers as munafiqeen; what gives anyone else the right to do so?<br>

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The sooner you go the hereafter the better. I'm sure there will be no "royal family" there and perhaps you may have a chance to think about your wasted life in the herebefore.

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Br Huzaif: So where do we meet you so that you can show us the doors of Jannat? Hope you guarantee us like your Moula does!Atleast i am happy you are quoting Moulana Ali -Who has more &purer quotes than your moula has!

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May be Hoz should do us all a favour and go where Serendepity (Suptidity) went (Yemen?)<br>And do not forget to take your hanky (you may leave w/o the Amex).<br>

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Muslim,<br>Cut the crap...In gujarat type of situation it was necessary for the bohras to dissociate themselves from muslims to save themselves from the indiscriminate killings by the frustrated Bajarangis (read hindus)....why should the bohras pay for something they havnt done?? ( which as a matter of fact even the sunnis havnt done)...there is a long history of animosity between Hindus and Sunni muslims in India....Bohras have traditionally kept a distance from the sunnis and the two cultures have no similarity whatsoever.<br>When Bohras say they are not "muslims" this means that they are not "Sunnis"....this laity is to drive their point into the thick skulls of the bajrangi dumbwits. The Hindus have been fucked up for the past one thousand years...first by the Muslims of central asia and then by the Britishers. Now they want to prove to themselves that they are not emasculate and that they too can "kill". So they now and then find targets. First they used to vent out their past frustrations on their own lower castes (shudras) and their own women by burning them in kitchens (dowry deaths). But since the fascist government has come to power, they have started targeting the minorities - christians and muslims, cuz they now have the administration and the police at their disposal, besides having the advantage of numbers.(they are 88 million in the population of 1 billion)....the hyenas have suddenly discovered that their number is more than five times that of the cheetah, and they have the humans providing them the cover fire too. <br> "So instead of praying upon the lowely species of our own pack and our own females why not attack the cheetah ?". <br> In such a situation it was wise on the part of the bohras to make clear to the pack of bajrangis that they do not belong to the group whom the latter have chosen this time to vent out their past frustrations and to prove to themselves that they too are "man".<br> <br> Its a different matter that the Godhra train burning which is supposed to have "triggered" the Gujrat genocide was itself a handiwork of the hindu fascist party BJP which was increasingly loosing its popularity and so needed to whip up communal passions once again. If the bajrangis stay for some more time, it would be no long before the banana republic of India annihilates itself.

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Huzaif<br>Here is some sisterly advice for you. Yes it is from Maulana Ali (as). I got mine without <br>RAZA -<p>The successful and bless are those who :-<br>who humbles himself before Allah, <br>whose sources of income are honest, <br>whose intentions are always honorable, <br>whose character is noble, <br>whose habits are sober, <br>who gives away in the cause and in the Name of Allah, the wealth which is lying surplus with him, <br>who controls his tongue from vicious and useless talk, <br>who abstains from oppression, <br>who faithfully follows the traditions of the Holy Prophet and <br>who keeps himself away from innovation in religion.<p>did you get that ?

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Br Huzaif: If you are a believer of Moulana Ali, Read the above by Sis Jinx & se where our Dai fits in even 1%?

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Sister Jinx,<p>Have you got the source ref for the "sayings" of Hazrat Ali (AS)quoted above?

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Yes, it's in the book call Maxims of Ali. I have hundreds of saying of Imam Ali(as).

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Thank you Jinx

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<br>Br Hzaif<p>who keeps himself away from innovation in religion.<p>Make sure of this.<p>Examine if Qadam Bosi, Grave Worshiping etc. etc. is not Innovation<p>

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Muslim First,<br>Taazeem of Awliyaullah is the beginning of faith. Without taazeem no amal is accepted. I pity that you do not have the faith in your soul to do taat of Awliyaullah. It is indeed a sad plight.

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huzaif is a product straight from the brainwashing institute of surat...the so called jamiya..I wonder how did he get an audience here...I mean do u people really think he'll make sense ??

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He is as fucked up in mind as mulla Q.<br>These are the idiots who cause the rot in our religion.

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<br>Br. Huzaif<p>Please translate your last post in simple ENGLISH.<p>Wasalaam<p>

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Muslim First,<br>You claim to be a Muslim but you are in reality the worst of people.<br>You are casting aspersions on a Maula who has one of the highest positions in the court of Allah.<br>Maulana Ali (AS) says - "Fidelity to the treacherous is treachery to God."<br>I urge u to reflect a little. What r your actions and how much little control u have over your lustful mind ?<br>

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<br>You are casting aspersions on a Maula who has one of the highest positions in the court of Allah.<p>There are plenty of cult members who claim that their "Taghut" will one who will have highest position in the court of Allah.<p>Only Allh Taala knows the best.<p>Wasalaam<p>**************************<p><br>Taghut<p>The word “Taghut” covers a wide range of meanings: It means anything worshipped other then the REAL GOD [ALLAH], i.e. all the falls deities. I may be satan, devils, idols, stones, sun, stars, angels, human beings (DAI, MULLAS, BHAI SAHEBS, SEHZADA’S ETC, ETC,) e., Messengers of Allah, who were falsely worshipped and taken as Taghut. Likewise Saints, graves, rulers and leaders (once again Dai) are falsely worshipped and wrongly followed. Some time Taghut means a false judge who goives a false judgement.<p>For reference to “Taghut” in Quran please study Ayahs 2:256- 257, 4:51, 4:60, 4:76, 5:60, 16:36, and 17:39 <p>Comments in (***) are mine<p><p><p>