The Quran on hunting and killing of animals for sport

[Bohra spring]

http://www.change.org/en-IN/petitions/s ... l-wildlife

16 signatures and counting

[Mkenya]

http://www.nation.co.ke/news/Kenya+warn ... index.html

[Conscíous]

http://www.change.org/en-IN/petitions/s ... l-wildlife
I'm not trying to wind up anyone, but this petitions doesn't make sense to me.. Can someone care to explain, after we have achieved 1000 signature, how is this going to stop our Maula ??

[asad]

Reports are coming in that Mansoos has killed one more lion in his recent visit. Pictures awaited.

[fearAllah]

Look at the way they are celebrating, as if they killed a big enemy of Sayedna and the Dawat!

[seeker110]

No bullet holes can be seen from this pictures.
The animal will die of shock when a bullet goes through the vitals (heart/lung) at rest.If the animal is moving and is shot when it is agitated than it dies due to blood pouring out of holes. For this big game 600 -1000 pounds a 150 grain bullet was most likely used. A shot on neck/brain or legs will be painful death. This is not the spot where it was killed ( no blood trail). Other party members are not carrying weapons, it is not hunting, it was killing for pleasure. A very sick mind.

[SBM]

^
The animal died of shock due to fear of Kothari Goons..

[BlackSaya]

Islam views the animal world as a world in its own right, just like that of the human world, with its own characteristics, temperaments and feelings. Since they are a community like mankind, they too deserve mercy and affection. The Prophet, peace be upon him, said, "The Merciful showers mercy on those who are themselves merciful." [Ahmad]

The Shariah has prescribed legislation regarding compassion to animals. It is prohibited to mount an animal for a long period of time whilst it is standing still. The Messenger of Allah said, "Do not take the backs of your animals as chairs." [Ahmad]

Wanton killing of animals for fun and sport has been strictly prohibited. The Prophet said, "Whoever kills even one bird wantonly, it will complain to Allah on the Day of Judgment, 'O my Lord and Cherisher! This person had killed me in vain and not for any benefit.'" [Nasai]

Likewise using animals as targets for practice is also prohibited. The Prophet has cursed the person who uses a living object as a target. [Bukhari, Muslim]

Compiled From:
"The Islamic Civilization"- Mustafa Sibai, pp. 124, 125

[seeker110]

I dont remember who said this , I heard it from a university professor, "tum apney paett ko janwaroun ka karastan na banaoe.

[trvoice]

No bullet holes can be seen from this pictures.
The animal will die of shock when a bullet goes through the vitals (heart/lung) at rest.If the animal is moving and is shot when it is agitated than it dies due to blood pouring out of holes. For this big game 600 -1000 pounds a 150 grain bullet was most likely used. A shot on neck/brain or legs will be painful death. This is not the spot where it was killed ( no blood trail). Other party members are not carrying weapons, it is not hunting, it was killing for pleasure. A very sick mind.

Gut shot, see the entry hole at the belly. Most like shot when animal was sleeping. Exit wound might be on the other side.

[Conscíous]

[Conscíous]

Ok guys.. Lets get on, where we left off,,
How come a loins life is worth more than fish?? I mean, just because Lions have become near extinction, that doesn't give it special privileges.. Killing big game animal is as nature as going fishing.. The only differences is, where you are in the society ladder.. The lower class justify their humanly thirst by fish don't feel pain, while the higher class will do all in the name of conservation/captive breeding/improve population and both are backed by scientific studies.. I believe one will get the same thrill, if your hocking a fish just as your hunting for pleasure..
And I'm even starting to doubt, if hocking a fish is permissible in Islam.. I believe the phrase used in the Quran is "catch fish".. Correct me if I'm wrong..

[Conscíous]

No one
Its ok,, I'll keep on rambling.. What I'm also trying to point out about the fishes is one day, they will also be extinct, so why can't we start to preserve them now, since we have already seen what has happened to the lions?? it's just a matter of time before the sea is empty

Ok let's discuss lions, since you guys favor it more.. To preserve the lions and other wild life, they've given large areas.. lets take Tanzania as an example, were humans have lived and shared the same land for generations, but now have to move because of preservation for the animals and also the Forest..

So my first question is,
is it morally correct that one specie is more worthier than another??
Is it ethical to take someone land for preservation of other species??
Is it ethical to displaces humans or animals from there natural habitat??

I'm sure you all must have thought of this, before jumping up and down to save the lions...

[Conscíous]

Haha..I'm sorry guys to spoil your party
I'm starting to believe those questions I've put forward, are very important, which none of us has thought threw.. I don't think you guys (that includes me also) have not really thought of the consequences for saving all the endanger species, because one day, everything will be endanger apart for us humans, because we will keep populating..

I don't know how to say this,, It's us (humans) that are the cause for many of the species that have been abolished right?? And we are also to be blamed for deforesting and global warm right?? For the past ten years, Why is there so much focus and awareness on those issues I've mentioned above?? Don't you wonder why so many tv channels are only dedicated on those subjects?? And I've even started to notice that news channels are also sending special programs on this subjects (CNN this week, had a program about gorillas).. Haven't we seen and heard a million times, how polar bear are perishing due to record sea-ice melt,, don't you wonder why all this awareness is for and what kind of message is behind all this??

Are you starting to wonder, maybe you have also been deluded just like the abde's in believing lies that has been feed to you by the corporate media about saving the planet or have I gotten all this wrong ??

[Conscíous]

Another thing which is worth discussing or at least something to think about,, today we are fighting for the rights (survival) of the lion while totally ignoring to what is happening to those indigenous people who have lived there for generation.. I see the same parallel with the Palestine conflict,, the Jews clam they must have some land to exist ( just like the lion ) and we see the displacement of the Palestine people..

[Al Fateh]

I dont know how come this guy mufaddal gets time for leisure while more then 100,000 bohras work hard and almost die every day to meet their expenses.

is it not clear there is some thing wrong with this guy?

[Bohra spring]

Fatehbhai..100,000 are working hard so Mansoos does not have to work

, see how great his rutba is...aek lakh mumineen ni kuwat barabar che , eni aram ni sans

Conscious...far out what are you going on about...where did you link Palestine issue with hunting in Africa.

Next time you are snorkelling try catching the fish the way you think it is permitted that is without a hook!

What rubbish are you talking that you want to justify lion hunts so the empty land can be occupied by indigenous . If you read proper facts Masai and people around African parks have always lived side by side with nature. It is the other way that humans are encroaching onto wildlife sanctuaries and the wildlife are killing humans ...the same is in India. There is no connection. Unless you want to build a mawaid in a park and lions are getting in your way .

Why do I feel you think polar bears are causing the ice melt? or suggesting Mansoos hunts bears as they are bigger than lions

[Conscíous]

Conscious...far out what are you going on about...where did you link Palestine issue with hunting in Africa.

one has to see and understand the history of the Jews and what happened to them during warII,, they were given land in the Middle East (the land which they clam it was theirs) so they could survive as a race.. The lions are in a similar situation..

Next time you are snorkelling try catching the fish the way you think it is permitted that is without a hook!

Brother,, the religion of Allah, is merciful and compassion towards animals,,To torture or to inflict unnecessary pain, is forbidden.. there are many ways to catch fish without the use of hocks or your hands.. If hocks are permissible according to you, then foot traps is also acceptable.. Both have the same function, that is to allure and trap the animal..

What rubbish are you talking that you want to justify lion hunts so the empty land can be occupied by indigenous . If you read proper facts Masai and people around African parks have always lived side by side with nature. It is the other way that humans are encroaching onto wildlife sanctuaries and the wildlife are killing humans ...the same is in India. There is no connection. Unless you want to build a mawaid in a park and lions are getting in your way .

haha.. Come on now, this is so easy to understand,, once a area is placed under conservation, humans are not allowed to inhabit or develop.. The whole surround area is cut off,, no roads, no shops, no way for the indigenous people to sell their goods ( if they have any ), after six in the evening, there is a curfew.. If you're lucky and get caught, you'll get a fine and in worst case, you end up getting shot and all this is because we keep hearing how poaching is a problem right?.. And to make life even harder, the indigenous are not allowed to cultivate because of deforestation and those who already are cultivating, will not be allowed to use fertilizer because the soil is getting terminated and infecting the drinking water for the endangered animals.. Crop production will decrease and in worst case, the indigenous people will not get their vital minerals and vitamins in there diet.. all this makes life more difficult and fearful.. And this scenario is almost identical to the Palestine situation..

Another thing is disease that can spread from humans to animals and other way around which is becoming a growing problem (bird flu, swine flu),,so it's only matter of time, when the Masai won't be allowed to roam freely

[Conscíous]

Haahaa... Over 200 people have read this thread and no one (apart from Br BS) wants to criticizes or ridicule me on my rambling on the issue I've raised huh?
I'm guessing you guys are not intresserted in what is happening to the indigenous people in Africa, but when it comes to the palestinian, you guys want to raise your voice,, being selective and favoring one race, is that not racism?

[Conscíous]

Here is what I found from Wikipedia about habitat conservation.. I'm going to copy and paste just a few paragraph that is related to my rambling..

Habitat conservation is a land management practice that seeks to conserve, protect and restore habitat areas for wild plants and animals, especially conservation reliant species, and prevent their extinction, fragmentation or reduction in range. It is a priority of many groups(you guys are a part of this groups "save the lions") that cannot be easily characterized in terms of any one ideology.(there is one ideology behind this, which some of you, already know)
Human impacts
Humans have been the cause of many species’ extinction. Due to humans’ changing and modifying their environment, the habitat of other species often become altered or destroyed as a result of human actions. Even before the modern industrial era, humans were having widespread, and major effects on the environment. A good example of this is found in Aboriginal Australians and Australian megafauna.Aboriginal hunting practices, which included burning large sections of forest at a time, eventually altered and changed Australia’s vegetation so much that many herbivorous megafauna species were left with no habitat and were driven into extinction. Once herbivorous megafauna species became extinct, carnivorous megafauna species soon followed. In the recent past, humans have been responsible for causing more extinctions within a given period of time than ever before. Deforestation, pollution, anthropogenic (caused by human) climate change and human settlements have all been driving forces in altering or destroying habitats.The destruction of ecosystems such as rainforests has resulted in countless habitats being destroyed. These biodiversity hotspots are home to millions of habitat specialists, which do not exist beyond a tiny area.Once their habitat is destroyed, they cease to exist.This destruction has a follow-on effect, as species which coexist or depend upon the existence of other species also become extinct, eventually resulting in the collapse of an entire ecosystem.These time-delayed extinctions are referred to as the extinction debt, which is the result of destroying and fragmenting habitats. As a result of anthropogenic (caused by human) modification of the environment, the extinction rate has climbed to the point where the Earth is now within a sixth mass extinction event, as commonly agreed by biologists.This has been particularly evident, for example, in the rapid decline in the number of amphibian species worldwide.

Approaches and methods of habitat conservation..
Determining the size, type and location of habitat to conserve is a complex area of conservation biology. Although difficult to measure and predict, the conservation value of a habitat is often a reflection of the quality (e.g. species abundance and diversity), endangerment of encompassing ecosystems, and spatial distribution of that habitat. (By this, any land can be possessed and that could easily be your backyard, if some rare endangered birds deicide to make it self homely or if they found some endangered species in that area, you can say bye bye to your home and all this is with your consent.. Today it's the Masai, tomorrow it will be you!! )
Identifying priority habitats for conservation
Habitat conservation is vital for protecting species and ecological processes. It is important to conserve and protect the space/ area in which that species occupies.
Continue reading here..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habitat_conservation

[Conscíous]

Zulfiqar bhai,, I'm sorry to have hijacked your thread, but I believe this issue I've raised is some how connected to this thread ( lol )..

[Conscíous]

Br Bohraspring,,
Did you know that the Masai were displaced from serengeti national park? Here's what I found from Wikipedia ( To preserve wildlife, the British evicted the resident Maasai from the park in 1959 and moved them to the Ngorongoro Conservation Area. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serengeti_National_Park )

and guess what's happening to them in Ngorongoro?

( 21 SEPTEMBER 2013 Tanzania: No Farming in Conservation Area, Says PM.. NGORONGORO residents' efforts to persuade the Prime Minister, Mr Mizengo Pinda to allow them start subsistence farming in the conservation area have hit snag but the Premier has promised to provide each household with free food. The residents want to be allowed to grow foodstuff in the wake of increasing famine and diminishing number of cattle that have for years been their lifeline. http://allafrica.com/stories/201309220101.html )

Do you guys still feel like saving the lion or any other animal my Maula is hunting huh ??

[Conscíous]

And there is a another thing I would like to discuss is, I keep hearing this phrase that my Maula is ( killing animals for pleasure )..

What I want to know is, how do you or those using this phrase know this??

He could be hunting for thousands of other reasons which are unknown to us unless you guys have become mind reads?

Or are you judging him according to your standards??

[Bohra spring]

He could be hunting for thousands of other reasons which are unknown to us unless you guys have become mind reads?

Give me a few of those thousand reasons and I will may be become an abde! Give up this munafikining and join the tolly of mumineen. Conscious I was really trying not to respond to your logical comments but was unsure if your ideas could really take off the ground , and fly

If you really need to hunt so be it ...may be we should be gracious as per your logic he is not hunting humans and reformists, whatever keeps his testosterone, and addiction and mojo pumping .

If you go on like this more abdes will take up the hunting to do what their Maula pleases and we will wipe out the planet of wildlife. Please stop recruiting new hunters.

I am not joking look everyone around in the community has a beard, topi , rida, look and act like the zadas, now every abde will be gun totting and booking safaris.

[Conscíous]

I don't know what the reason is, but it is surely not to save the indigenous people of Africa.. Maybe Adam Bhai can enlighten us.. This is the only subject he hasn't touched and if he thinks that he has gone unnoticed, than he is completely wrong.. I'm guessing even him, is going to have a difficult task to justify this kind of hunting that our Maula is doing, in accordance with the Quran..

And I'm in no way trying to encourage hunting.. In fact, it will be only the rich and local (for now) can enjoy this sport., for the rest of us, it's not going to be affordable and soon only the privilege ones will be allow for safari.. The closest our children will ever come to a lion will be in the zoo or the tv screen..
Do you really know, whom you guys think you are going to leave this planet to??
Giving so much attention to animals and the environment, will this change the foundation of religion ??

And the reason for comparing hunting and fishing was, 99% for those who are so obsessed about our Maula's hunting, are not any better or pious.. As the famous quote by Bob Marley goes.." before you start pointing fingers... make sure you hands are clean!”

[Al Fateh]

^ cant believe educated guys like conscious are turning in to morons in present muffy regime....

[Conscíous]

I forgot to mention, that I'm arguing for our Maula as a humanbeing and not as a religious leader or how he finance his hunting trips..

Br Al Fateh,,
Even if I've changed sides in this discussion while trying to provoke a dialogue, I've not changed my stances..

The big dilemma is, who should occupy that piece of land. The Masai or the lions and other wildlife ?

What if animals receive higher or the same rights as humans, how will religion adept to this?
What if stones and rocks, which are also part of the eco system are given the same rights as humans, will religion like Islam accept this?
Will you as a Muslim or human, accept that dead things are just or even more worthy than you?
Giving so much emphasis to the environment and endanger species, will this not lead towards neopaganism?

[Bohra spring]

When society shows more courage and moral than abdes

When only 29 opponents in 1 million signed the petition we raised

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/s ... l-wildlife


In the case below thousands of mushrikeen would stand up and correct when one of their own goes astray. Are we still the chosen one to go to heaven with our Ayashi.

US TV presenter Melissa Bachman blasted over smiling photo with lion she 'stalked and killed'

Ms Bachman said she killed the lion on a hunt in South Africa, where a petition has now been started to have her barred from the country

Tomas Jivanda

Saturday, 16 November 2013
An American TV presenter is facing an outraged public backlash after she posted a picture of herself posing next to a dead lion she had apparently shot and killed.


Melissa Bachman tweeted the picture of her smiling alongside the animal with the message: “An incredible day hunting in South Africa! Stalked inside 60 yards on this beautiful male lion … what a hunt!”

The picture was also added to Facebook as part of an album called “Africa 2013”, which included images of her next to a dead zebra and a variety of shot antelope, as well as the lion, following a trip to the Maroi Conservancy hunting park.

Now South Africans have started a petition to have Ms Bachman banned from the country, which presently has over 12,000 signatures.

The petition asks supporters to sign a letter directed at the South African government that reads: “She is an absolute contradiction to the culture of conservation, this country prides itself on. Her latest Facebook post features her with a lion she has just executed and murdered in our country.

“As tax payers we demand she no longer be granted access to this country and its natural resources.”

The presenter's Twitter account has since been taken down and the contact form on her website disabled. Her Facecbook page however remains public. The images have been shared hundreds of times on the social network, largely with negative comments attached.

Posing next to dead animals is nothing new for Ms Bachmann, who says she has been hunting since she was a child. Her Facebook page and personal website’s “trophy room” features many such images, including a number with stags, alligators and bears.

Ms Bachman stars in a TV series called Winchester Deadly Passion which documents her hunting exploits using rifles or bow and arrows.

A self professed “hardcore hunter”, her bio reads: “I have the best job in the world, great friends & family, and I'm usually pretty lucky. What more could a girl ask for??”

Last year Ms Bachman was removed as a contestant on the National Geographic show Ultimate Survival Alaska when over 13,000 people signed a petition criticising her inclusion.

[Bohra spring]

Auspicious no 52 have signed the petition to date

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/s ... l-wildlife

[Al Zulfiqar]

i have reliable reports that once chelum for bawaji saheb is over and muffy has fended off the attacks and challenge from his kaka, his first order of business will be to arrange a shikar trip to tanzania where he has vowed to kill atleast 4 lions, 2 elephants, 12 water buffalo, 3 leopards, about 2 dozen wildebeest, a dozen crocodiles, a few hippos and as many wild boar as he can handle/locate.

this is to relieve the tremendous stress that he has been facing these last few weeks. this blood-thirsty shikar trip will be a celebration of orgiastic proportions wherein muffy will release all his blood-lust and slaughter dozens of wild and endangered species. these shohoda creatures will symbolise his kakapipi kq's family and as such can be safely eliminated from the face of this earth.

a new and latest high tech set of telescopic rifles, big bore imploding bullets, the most luxurious tents fitted with air conditioning and toilets, chefs, outdoor furniture etc are being organised. east african abdes are already mentally preparing for this visit from muffy, the sharp-toothed, bare-fanged animal slayer.

no one dare utter a word in protest. muffy's eternal father, who art in heaven and hallowed be his name - al hayel smb - is pulling the strings up there and the panjatan and hazar imam himself are backing his every move and divine khidmat. muffy has testified to this fact just as he has testified most truthfully about his late brother hoze', also about hussain conversing with dhuljana before his martyrdom, hussain's duas for sts and smb in his last sajda seconds before his tragic murder, and many other such amazing details which no notable islamic personality has yet been privy to in the last 1400+ years.

even the animals in africa are undertaking sajda marathons and frantic maatam, praying that their mubarak maut be at the hands of nabi muffy.